Really great article, this, that puts Wilder's career into perspective.
Nice ending paragraph:
"Wilder never quite achieved the all-time greatness his Bomb Zquad cultists proclaimed, nor was he quite as bad as insisted by the armchair critics who vastly outnumbered them. In the end he was a country kid who extracted as much as possible from his natural talent, went from rags to riches, brought loads of excitement for more than a decade to a heavyweight division that needed it and left an indelible mark on the sport. In a cruel trade where happy endings are few and far between, that’s plenty good enough."
I also give Wilder credit for repping Alabama, a state that’s shit on not only by Americans but other countries as well so I’m sure it felt good for a lot of Alabama natives to have a guy like Wilder in the limelight.
My car broke down in Tuscaloosa and a network of locals looked out for us for about a week and helped us get a room and scrap my car so we could get a bus home. They were really proud of their college there
The government of Alabama had a day off today to honor the birthday of Jefferson Davis, the confederate president. [Literally today.](https://www.al.com/news/2024/06/alabama-state-offices-are-closed-today-for-another-confederate-holiday.html)
Yes they are I went to school in Alabama for a year and a half they literally call black people Mondays and have secret racist lyrics to classic country songs
Part of my family is from Alabama. I've lived in 11 states. Alabama is absolutely the most racist. I've lived in many southern states and AL is a whole different beast. I can tell stories If you want.
I don’t like when people shit on Alabama, there’s a lot of good people there trying and i feel bad for the ignorant people who get fooled by politicians, even they deserve better.
Im from California but its real small minded to crap on them, the political situation isn’t so simple.
The article rightfully states "What if he’d come from a boxing hotbed instead of a backwater with a negligible record for producing quality fighters?"
I don't think enough people give him credit for making it this far while coming from the middle of nowhere. Terrance Crawford coming from Omaha doesn't get enough credit either. Rarely do boxers just emerge from nowhere. You have to grow up fighting in the amateurs surrounded by good fighters in NY, Detroit, Chicago, LA, etc to get really good while really young. Location matters. Uzbekistan is currently seeing a huge rise in professional fighters after having several successful amateur years.
You could pick up boxing at 14-15 and some of these kids could have almost a decade of experience on you already. You hear about Lomachenko dad teaching him footwork before how to punch. Incredible
That's most skill sports. If you look at any successful QB it's very likely they've been doing QB camps paid for by their rich parents since they were kids. Then those kids compete with kids who showed up and joined the team in 9th grade. I do BJJ and almost every big name athlete from this current generation are either 2nd or 3rd generation or their parents pulled them out of school and moved and "homeschooled" them and sent them to a top gym all day.
Bro I grew up in the midwest/ south out in the country and always wanted to box growing up. The closest gym was like 1.5 hours a way in some church, probably not even a legit gym. U def. need to be near a big city.
This is one big reason why small countries like Cuba and Uzbekistan and Ireland do so well at Olympic boxing: even small towns have at least one boxing gym.
I live in Ireland and you are never more than 10 miles from a gym. Even a town of 25k people here might have 2 or more gyms sometimes.
Spot on summary of Wilder.
He was a genetic freak with the ultimate equaliser which allowed him to overachieve.
He also had a ton of heart. There was no quit in him and that gave us a brilliant 3rd fight with Fury and memorable knock outs of Ortiz. Let’s also give him props for taking the fights with Parker and Zhang whilst being at the end of his career.
I don’t think we’ll ever see an enigma quit like Wilder in the heavyweight division again.
Precisely, what made him so damn entertaining was his defying all boxing snobs and convention.
Because his sheer power, and athleticism and a durable chin just over ruled everything.
It's a shame to see him now as he's nothing like the fighter he was 10 years ago...
Some fighters age like fine wine like foreman...wilder seems to have aged terribly. It happens.
Personally I'd like to see him crush a can one more time before he leaves but wish him well, I gather he's mulling over having one more fight as turki will offer him one more, so best of luck to him with whatever he decides.
Wilder seemed to begin second-guessing himself during & in the fights following Fury-sequel .. and for a fighter with the style of Wilder that is apocalyptic
He definitely did second-guessed himself before the Helanius KO.
Everyone I was watching with thought he looked scared until he dropped him then he got credit for setting it up with his legs as something new.
However, two fights later and dude is clearly shook and got lucky Helanius ran into his fist.
The fact he said "I still got it" to someone in the crowd after should have been taken more seriously at the time
But thats the point: Helenius was easy to tag and couldn't take Wilders shot. Parker and Zhang could. Wilder absolutely landed power shots on Zhang and Parker. The fact they shook it off was the difference. Wilders power has always been somewhat exagerrated: His world title fights lasted an avg of 8 rounds for example. It's not like he was destroying everyone in 30 seconds, as some people seem to think
Let's be real, no one was saying Wilder was done after Helenius. Let's remember Parker was seen by some as an underdog.
At the time, no one thought he was done. However, in hindsight he fought like one round in two years, cried after KOing the guy in that fight, and was filming a reality show before the Saudis offered him 10mil.
He was definitely moving like a finished fighter 🤷♂️
This is a really bad and revisionist take. Wilder was a shit, shit fighter in almost every way, but his power was otherworldly. He didn't land any meaningful right hands at the correct range on either Zhang or Parker and his fights went "long" on average because he sucks and doesn't land clean punches hardly ever. It is all glancing blows and misses intersped with long periods of waiting to uncoil at all. The power was real and historic. If it wasn't, he never even would have been a pro fighter at all let alone achieve what he did. It is just too bad he started so late and/or wasn't some super coordinated natural athlete.
I would go as far as to say the Wilder had the most power I have ever seen and I have been obsessing over the fight sports since the early 90s as a kid.
Heres why I disagree. In literally all his totel fights, he lands right hands flush way before the KO. Excluding Parker and Zhang did an excellent job of shutting down Wilders very limited attacks (which too many people since Saturday seem to be giving them zero credit for btw) he caught all those guys flush.
Chris Arreola has said Vitali hit harder than Wilder. Wilder has faced 3 in shape skillful HWs and failed to knock any of them out over 5 fights. If Wilder was fighting a Molina type guy last Saturday instead of Zhang, are you seriously telling me he wouldn't have KO'd them? He almost certainly would have.
You cannot say Wilder has GOAT power when he's only knocked out guys who had been dropped and or KO'd multiple times, before and after, most of whom had near zero defence, and many of whom took multiple right hands from Wilder before the finish.
Unfortunately I wish you were correct but the truth is the man is fighting elite boxers now, he’s fighting someone who can punch and box in Zhang, he’s fighting Joseph Parker who has a good chin fast hands good movement, he’s fighting Fury a 7 foot bear moth. Maybe if he would’ve fought Wlad and Povetkin after winning the WBC you’d be right but really he was protected and didn’t defy shit.
Nah he did v well against fury in 2 fights, much much better than dillian whyte.
Wilders either nowhere near as good as dillian whyte or he's better. Imo 2015 wilder was far better than dilian whyte.
I never claimed wilder was on prime oovetkin or wlad level. Because he wasn't.
But he was damn good, most folk haven't watched old school deontay wilder fights. They're casuals who started watching him when he was older and more washed.
Areola and duhaupas aren't complete trash fighters tbh. Neither is ortiz.
Anyway I done debating with wilder haters. It's over. I personally hope he comes back and ends on a win but if not he's had a great career.
People are over emphasising too much Wilder aging. The reality is best version of Wilder still almost certainly loses to Parker and Zhang. They had spot on tactics to take away Wilders space, which then vastly reduces how effective his right hand is. And that's wilders only weapon. His step up on quality was a massive reason he lost. If Wilder fought another Molina type fighter last weekend, he woulda KO'd them.
I don't get how people are saying Wilder aged horribly when he smoked Helenius in 1 round post Fury.
It's a nice piece.
I've really enjoyed the post-Wlad period of the HW division, and I don't get the constant shitting on the top fighters in the division. It's been a fun ride with lots of great fights.
There's an alternative universe where Wilder never goes into that gym, never starts fighting. That universe has a less interesting HW division from 2015-2022.
I feel people dump on top fighters because what makes them exciting is also what makes them easier to criticise: Their weaknesses
Let's be real Wilder was dramatic to watch as much because of his many flaws as his punching power. You never knew if he was going to KO someone or get KO'd himself or schooled over 12.
Guys like Vitali were wat less dramatic because they had sleds weaknesses, and so their was never as much jeopardy or drama in those fights.
I guess I fall into the armchair critic camp then but we definitely didn't outnumber the Bomb Zquad cultists at every point in his career. I remember being vastly outnumbered when I said he was overrated when people thought he'd beat some of history's greats after beating Ortiz.
Wilder has undoubtedly been entertaining though and I enjoyed his fights very much. A great addition to this era but one of the most overrated fighters of this era.
Here's why that's a terrible take: You or I have never once seen Wilder beat a HW with good skills who was in shape.
Never once.
You cannot compare the Z tier guys Wilder mostly fought to great or even good HWs of bygone eras. They are galaxies apart.
You simply cannot extrapolate how Wilder does vs genuinely good in shape HWs, because he never actually beat one. The only good skillful on shape HWs he fought, he failed to beat. And his loses were all very one sided.
Not sure if this was sarcasm, but let me use an analogy because many people who watch boxing don't always get the technical parts of the sport.
Say you see 2 guys race in the park. Both have horrible running technique, but one is taller and has a longer stride. The other guy is not even in good shape. They race for 10 metres, taller guy wins, in not a very fast time.
Now, imagine I told you "See that that guy who won, because he beat this out of shape short guy who had very little running technique, i am 100% certain he'd beat Usain Bolt in 100m"
You'd laugh at me, right?
But that's _exactly what Wilder advocates do_ when they suggest he would've KO'd a Lennox Lewis or Riddick Bowe or Vitali Klitschko simply because he KO'd a shorter, out of shape guy with little technique like Bermane Stiverne.
It's just as crazy, and just as laughable. You can't point to the moon in the sky and then say you know as much about Astrophysics as Neil Degrasse Tyson.
That power puncher's dice roll chance is not something any of the great heavyweights have ever built a career on, even though plenty of the greats have had it. Yes, he could hit, but landing was always a lottery. He also showed a *lot* of heart and grit in the Tyson Fury fights, but he's a very mediocre talent with limited ring intelligence, if we're talking top 30-40 all time, who made the most of his limited talents.
He's also aged badly (perhaps because of being demolished by Fury) and has a difficult body type/base weight - in this fight he looks like a small cruiser, way under weight. He actually looked to be in great shape, but not for a boxing match against someone like Zhang. Hopefully he quits and stays retired - he's the sort of fighter who decides to make a comeback in 2 years and it goes very badly.
He hasn't aged well but I'm not talking about 38 year old Wilder when I say that. I also think people overlook his skills because while he has never been a technician of any sort, he does more to set up his power than just randomly throw and hope it lands. Really, he was a fascinating fighter because he was so confident in his power that none of his work went into winning rounds, but there's a reason he was able to land on everybody until recently.
Tbf critics like you have had to age wilder out to be able to crush him.
He's aged terribly and would have fared much much much better against parker and zhang 10 years ago.
His losses to Fury took more from him than age did.
He would have done better against Parker and Zhang 10 years ago but, given they're probably the 2nd and 3rd best guys he's faced, there's a better than good chance he'd still have lost.
True, but name an athlete over 36 that relied on his athleticism
Fury III was his last act unless he could learn to box in two years.
Kobe and Jordan relied on their fadeaway rather than jumping out the gym at that age. Wilder never learned his version of the fadeaway and hit the wall insanely hard when he wasn't a god among men anymore.
He would not. Parker and Zhang did a great job of taking us space, which if you boxed you know means that really nerfed Wilders right.
People are giving Parker and Zhang far too little credit here. 2024 Wilder would still KO most HWs.
They don't seem to get you cannot compare a Parker to a Molina or a Zhang to a Washington. Those guys are light years apart.
It's true though, wilder has never had good footwork or fundamental ls.
It's just he was able to defy that with his power, athleticism and chin durability before.
Now he's washed and old and doesn't have any of that you haters get to have a field day.
I'll repeat wilder would have beaten zhang and Parker 10 years ago.
I don't get people that argue otherwise,like just watching his old fights you can see that he did have shit techinque but as you said he was faster,his punches were faster,more powerful,he had intention of killing his opponent before,he took punches better aswell.
We all know he was never better skill-wise but you can't deny that he was phisically and mentaly stronger back then.
7,8 years ago,Parker and Zhang get KO'd just like everyone else and these same people would be saying they are just cans that Wilder crushed like the rest of the guys on his record.
No they wouldn’t just like no one equivalent got KO’d back then because his best wins for 5y as a champion still are against a 97yo Ortiz who was beating him over all rounds but was just too old to keep the pace.
If 38yo Wilder is shot I’d love to see what you have to say about 41yo Ortiz at the time.
Agree completely.
If you've followed wilders entire career like I have. I actually saw him fight in Beijing...then you'd know he used to be a different animal.
He had muscles on his muscles, huge back, freakish arm speed in ring. And moved far quicker and on his feet to cut space. Was far more aggressive, and more dominant. His punches had far more accuracy. And he just carried this invincible aura.
He could go and bully a guy like parker or zhang before.
No chance now because he's so frail. He looks ill these days...
Wilder fighting at CW would have been the dumbest career move possible
He'd have been fighting Usyk, Breidis, Gassiev, Doriticos and Hunter for peanuts around the time he was becoming HW champion. He'd quite possibly have never been a World Champ
Wilder has almost never faced opponents 40-60lbs heavier than him. Since Audley Harrison (can't be arsed to check back any further and before then it's real low level stuff) most opponents were within 10lbs of him (he was low to mid 220s), the odd one is 20lbs heavier like Arreola and Ortiz, and one, Stiverne, was 30lbs heavier
Very few fighters have had to overcome such a weight discrepancy in a world title fight, not because it's so difficult to do, but because it's very rare for a world champion to weigh that much.
Even still, it's happened before, particularly the 40lbs for Fury, that's happened loads, some off the top of my head, but I'm sure there is loads more - HW world title fights where the Victor weighed more than 40lbs less than their opponent:
Max Baer Vs Primo Carnera (54lbs)
Anthony Joshua Vs Andy Ruiz (46lbs)
Ibragimov Vs Shannon Briggs (52lbs)
Jack Dempsey Vs Jess Willard (58lbs)
Evander Holyfield Vs George Foreman (49lbs)
Obviously if we look outside world title fights, like the Zhang fight was, there are 100s, if not 1000s of examples
I’m really getting tired of these people who have no idea about fighting or sports saying things like ‘he never had much skill other than his right.’ You think it’s easy to be one of the top 3 olympians in any sport or hold the WBC belt for a near record title defenses? That means out of the 6 billion people on earth, NO ONE could beat him for years . These people couldn’t have done anything physical their whole life to understand the concept of making the pro or even division 1 level at any sport . ‘Oh but he didn’t fight anyone.’ Really ???? Who did Mike Tyson fight? Not bowe, oh yea Holyfield and Lewis for an 0-3 title and got ko’d by people who were NOT ranked in his last two fights within 6 rounds- and Tyson was younger than wilder! Both 38
I read it this morning and thought it was a fair and balanced article. He can be proud of his career, yes it was padded with plenty of knockouts over tomato cans, but he exceeded expectations given his relatively limited skillset and had 10 world title defenses. Nothing to be ashamed of, except perhaps his bizarre outbursts and excuses.
I don’t like “what ifs” regarding boxer ability but Wilder without his power is just another tomato can. Wilder to me is an experiment showing how far somebody could get if they only had one punch in their arsenal.
Maybe I’m getting ahead of myself here but I genuinely don’t think we’ll ever see a heavyweight champion like Wilder again tbh, a guy with barely any technical fundamentals and just one punch. It’s like something from a video game. Dude was fortunate to box in this era.
I agree, I understand he wasn’t boxing any and everyone but for a dude with no skill and experience he sure was beating a lot of career boxers. He also doesn’t get enough credit for his Fury fights even if he lost. The alleged best heavyweight ever was having trouble with a guy that could only throw one punch.
Still funny to think Fury struggled more with Wilder than he did with other „top“ boxers like Whyte or Wlad, Fury struggled more with Wilder than fucking Wlad 😭. Granted Wlad woudlve killed Wilder had they fought but styles make fights
Fury lost his fancy movement and couldn't run away or move efficiently like he did before his suspension. He had to stand his ground more because of that
Wilders not always been as bad as his critics would love him to be.
He was 10 times the fighter he is today 10 years ago.
It's just you lot and casuals only started to pay attention to him when he was in his mid 30s.
Ive followed his entire career.
Wilder's first fight vs Stiverne where he actually had to be technical because of his broken hand and before he fell in love with his power completely is his best performance imo.
Like seriously compare the way he used his jab in that fight to the last 5 years
I think his fight v duhaupas is his most rounded technical display of inside fighting.
That was in 2015.
His boxing game went to sh** shortly after that and he just paced the ring looking for the bomb.
Yup, he used to just be so much quicker and explosive than everyone that his lack of technique didn't matter because his reflexes were absolutely insane and she would just throw it and beat you to it
He was the unfortunate two big of a risk to fight in his younger years but couldn't get the right marketing to become a major name to get the fights. Everyone talks about the belt no one talks that a WBC champ who knocks out everyone couldn't get PPV main event. Unfortunately, Shelley Finkle put him with Mark Breland rather than Freddy Roach which had he'd been in Wildcard Gym he would've gained more of a bigger following than he had just because he was near Manny and others at Wildcard at the time.
To be honest, he probably would have been better in past eras because he likely grows up wanting to be Ali rather than dreaming of catching touchdowns/dunking for the Crimson Tide
Roy Jones Jr. and Ali wouldn't have accomplished much without their speed/reflexes either, they also had pretty poor fundamentals which they covered up with their speed advantage.
Don't forget the quick twitch muscles and insane reach
Dude never learned to box because his straight used just beat people to the punch until about 36 off the strength of his reflexes and natural speed
I was just about to say: with all due respect, the guy has a lot to be ashamed of, like forty different things actually, and they all happen to be excuses
I’ve always been conflicted with Wilder as a person. I remember how he comforted Luis Ortiz after his loss to Andy Ruiz and thinking he was a solid dude. Then you hear about some of his out of ring antics and his failure to accept his loss to Fury and it makes you rethink his character. Either way, he’s an athlete and an entertainer and he delivered a lot of quality content for the boxing world.
Tbf he only made excuses for his loss to Fury, unlike to Parker and Zhang who were nice to him for the most part, compare this to Fury who’s just a fucking prick 😂
He just has a burning hatred for Fury specifically. Maybe I’m wrong but there’s something funny imagining he would only make these excuses for a guy like Fury
I mean Fury is an asshole I can appreciate his skill but he is a massive jerk and he only did that in the 2nd Fury fight after putting up virtually no resistance. I think he was more upset he didn't put up a good effort and he put up all his effort in the 3rd fight so he felt he didn't have to make anymore excuses. I'm a huge Deontay but all the excuses after the 2nd fight upset me as a fan. He never did before or since but unfortunately that's gonna be apart of his story now but I think the kos and great fights will drown it out with time
He made the excuse to keep the promotion he was on thin ice with Al Haymon and needed to keep his name in the press. The excuses for him seem to be the right route be he started to believe them.
Yes because he took that fight to court, I don't think you understand the whole thing. PBC placed him on his first PPV which in their minds was a KO of Fury that didn't happen. His second fight against Ortiz did not sell, so it was back to the second Fury fight. When he lost he had to come up in his mind with millions of excuses for why a rematch should take place and had to take it to arbitration to get the third fight. And the third fight sold not as well as the second but he won many over with the amount of heart he put in. However the fight was still a negative in sales and Al decided if he was anything like Mayweather or Tank a fight against a no name like Helenius would sell at least 150k and that fight sold 75k. His promoters quietly got rid of him which led him to Turki for the Saudi fights.
What out ring antics? Apart from fight week or when he's close to a fight and in kill mode (this energy has been missing for the last 2 fights) I've heard he a really good guy.
He allegedly choked out a prostitute in Las Vegas. I say allegedly but I’m pretty sure he was arrested for it, and his reasoning was she tried to steal his wallet
The one I always think of was Wilder falsely accusing the salsa dancer of being a “traitor” in this game show, being proven wrong, and literally breaking down bawling because he felt so awful he had accused someone incorrectly. Was so incredibly weird to see
Accusations that someone else cheated to the point of poisoning him and inventing insane conspiracies doesn’t make him a bad person but it does show you he’s lost touch with reality
Yeah… I agree. I don’t know why ppl have to go as far as questioning if he’s a good person though. He’s a sore loser. Boxing is littered with them. There are actual bad ppl in the sport to hate… Wilder gets too much in my opinion
I think boxers on Reddit get too caught up in bad/good people shit...
People will say Teo is a bad person but rep Tank One of them is a woman beater and another one talks a lot of trash. Being annoying is not being a BAD person.
MMA fans do this too
In a sport filled with violence and heartbreak, he started late to be able to afford medication for his daughter’s condition. Idk how people can hate a guy like that.
What proof is there that he’s a good person lol
He’s been vocal about wanting a body on his record, he talks about murdering people like it’s nothing. I can’t imagine anyone from my friends and family saying something like that. Can you?
He's an asshole because he beats women and his own brother, and cheated on his wife with his brother's girlfriend. Also said he wanted to kill people in the ring, and is dumber than a bag of hammers. I'm sure he can be nice and what he did for his daughter is incredible, but he's done quite a lot of not- great sh\*t.
He’s “conflicted with him as a person” because of his “failure to accept his loss to Fury”
How am I putting words in his mouth for properly comprehending what he wrote?
Why are you being hostile?
I can't speak for everyone, but Wilder/Fury I was so intense and entertaining that it got me back into boxing. Since I have followed the sport closer than I have ever have. I thought Wilder had his chances in all 3 fights, really, more so 1 & 3. He was seconds away in one... his role in that fight, for me, I'm sure there are other fights like that in different eras that relate, but I really feel that fight was the catalyst to the surge the Heavyweight division has seen in popularity.
He may not have ever been the greatest technical boxer in the world, but he got American's back into watching the heavyweight division and having an interested in it again after 20 years! You can never take that away from him.
Wasn't the greatest technical gifted boxer around but man the dude gave you some great entertaining fights, he's earned millions he should hang his gloves up and ride into the sunset and look after his family.
> If he’d come about in the first half of the 20th century, before boxing’s gradual retreat toward the margins of American life, there’s no question Wilder would have been one of the country’s most famous athletes. These days a fighter needs a special something to truly cross over into the cultural mainstream, but not even Wilder’s made-for-YouTube knack for separating opponents from their senses was enough. Outside the ropes he wasn’t stylish. His Alabama drawl was mistaken for dim-wittedness. Not even Wilder’s knockout-friendly approach was enough for him to become a truly reliable box office attraction, a fact that Fury needled him with relentlessly and with cruel intentions. All of it created a chip on his shoulder which only grew as the years passed.
It wasn't his drawl it was his horrendous promotion until Stiverne 2.
There is zero reason why Wilder could not have at least achieved like Gervonta Davis level PPV buy numbers.
I always had fun with him. When he was knocking mfs out he was fun, when he took an L and blamed it on gypsy magic he was fun, even his most recent L was fun in the way he spun in a damn circle before going down
I don't care what any of these armchair boxing experts say, he contributed a lot to a sport and to a division that needed some excitement. I honestly thought he was done when he took on Ortiz (twice!) but he has some very solid wins over solid competition in the last part of his career before falling off a cliff. He should be very proud of his career, what he accomplished, and what he did for his family.
I really think he’ll be the last great American heavyweight we see for a very long time. Jared Anderson is less exciting as time goes by. There are a few others but all look weak. More young kids big enough to be a good HW get out into football or basketball. One will come along eventually but it’s sad compared to what the US once produced.
I think he didn't help himself with all the conspiracies about the fury losses, how he treated Breland, and saying he wanted to kill someone in the ring. Made him really unlikable. But good for him getting some money.
Yeah, article talks about that a bit. I agree with the writer that a lot of the "body on the record" stuff was him trying to lean into a persona that didn't really suit him, and was all a front for promotion that backfired.
I definitely felt that. He would try to talk slick and be a villain when his highlights sold themselves. Usually came off as not a good speaker.l 7th Bomb squad and to this day caught on though. Honestly the catch a body stuff and excuses are lame but whatever, the breland thing us real bad. Saying that he tampered with his drink. And he should be thanking him for stopping the fight.
The reason was Haymon was attempting to get rid of him after the first Fury fight as it was a big cost and had lowered his marketability. Breland stopping the fight showed everyone Deontay couldn't beat Fury. Deontay busted his ass to win but the second failure in the third Fury fight mentally destroyed him.
Hes such an odd guy, he’s not good but he’s it exactly bad, the sacrifices he made for his daughter are commendable, I mean putting yourself in a sport where you could die or more likely end up with just CTE just so you can support your family is a pretty good reason.
I mean he’s still heavily flawed but so are most boxers for some reason, ig the CTE really affected their way of thinking
Dude is a weird case. He’s said a lot of dumb shit that’s made him unlikeable. But I remember when he did JRE, I came away from that a fan of him. He was super genuine and seemed like a solid decent dude.
If we get just one more fight from Wilder before he retires I actually hope it’s against Whyte. There was a lot of bad blood against them a few years ago as Wilder refused to face Whyte when he was mandatory for like 36 years whilst WBC protected him. At that time it was an exciting fight for me as Whyte was slowly making his way back to the top. Let them settle it.
Plus they’ve both dropped out of the top ~5 and I would probably rank them around the same level. I see zero reason for AJ vs Wilder after the last two performances we’ve seen from him.
Wilder needed a really good trainer…at least a decade ago. It would have made all the difference. He may never have become a boxing great but with his power and good training, he would have been difficult to beat as easily as Parker or Zhang did. Having said that, if my aunt had whiskers, she would have been my uncle
If nothing else, he took his limited skills and earned himself an Olympic bronze, a world championship, and millions. All while somehow convincing a certain chunk of fans that he was the greatest HW in the past 30 years.
Unfortunately he held up the division and ran from quality opponents until he no longer could. And since taking quality opponent he has lost 4 of 5 fight and been knocked out 3 times.
I probably wouldn't of had as much a problem with him if it wasn’t for his delusional fans, ridiculous excuses, and the fact he threw Mark Breland under the bus. Trashing him and attempting to destroy his reputation.
You all are here talking like he’s dead or retired. You don’t realize that he’s going to fight again and the story ain’t completely over yet. Yes we’re on the last chapter, but there’s still a a few pages left to go before the ending.
I thought that Wilder would be the one to have Tank's status because of the division he's in, his KOs and Olympic pedigree. In hindsight whoever promotes him really failed to capitalized his potential popularity-wise
I've always known that AJ and Fury were better, but I'm not going insane wondering why people rated Wilder highly back then. He was a dangerous fighter that fell short of truly elite-- no more no less
Despite some missed opportunities, Wilder was a great addition to this generation of HW and I'll miss him
The problem for Deontay started with his insane excuse after Fury 2. Most people knew he was limited. "Windmill" has been a joke about Deontay since before 2015.
But most people just had a problem with him not improving and knowing it would hurt him once he truly stepped up. But they didn't really have a problem with Deontay as a person. When he went crazy after Fury 2 including literally blaming his corner, his costume, Fury's cheating, etc, etc, people started to also have a problem with him as a person.
Had Deontay never gone down that dark corner, I think most would be kinder with his legacy. They'd still say he never had a signature win and was limited, but it would be followed with "a good dude that made what he had work for him to get him farther than he should have." But once the "good dude" thing went away, people just plain wanted to see him kicked to the curb.
I didn't even have a problem with the "get me a body" talk as I wrote it off as promotion talk. Promo talk that went too far, but I never thought he was serious.
Deontay would do himself a world of good if he retired and in his farewell speech, he owns up that he was under severe emotional stress and wishes he could take back his actions after Fury 2. And specifically asking Breland for forgiveness.
One thing I don’t see mentioned enough here is that, for Deontay Wilder to have taken up boxing late, not have had developed a legitimate technical offense, win a world heavyweight championship that he defended ten times, he HAD to have been an amazing .1% athlete.
Known to all great athletes, Father Time is undefeated. From pathos to ire and a spectrum of spectator feelings everywhere between, Deontay Wilder might truly be one of a kind. That’s worth celebrating.
>But it wasn’t long before the gnawing memories of his sporting prowess led him down a dirt road off a quiet offshoot of Route 30
these journos think they are Stephen King doing some world building
That seems like a fine sentence to me.. how do you want your sports articles to be written?
“Deontay Wilder then had interest in boxing. He trained at boxing. He got good at boxing. Some thought he was better than he was. Some thought he was worse than he was. He said some controversial things. He was exciting. The end”
He did good by himself and his family, but he also held up the division even worse than Fury did. The division should have been unified two or three times before it was, but Wilder either ducked (Klitschko, Joshua) or forced rematches when he really shouldn't have for his own sake (Fury III). I could excuse that a bit if he actually did good things with his strap, but all he did was fight gatekeeper level guys, Ortiz, and cherry pick gone wrong in Fury. I think he overall hurt the sport and is emblematic of the issues of his era of boxing. Nothing against him as a person, though.
IMO Best thing he did was trash talk fury to get off the couch. He does seem to possess the touch of death though which eliminated a lot of top 15-10 level. Didn’t hang in long enough to get matched against Usyk or Joshua. Was fun when those three names were being tossed around. Very heartwarming personal story but overshadowed by blaming heavy walkout dress and armor in Furt fight.
I can't help but wonder what Deontay Wilder would have been if he had someone like the late Manny Steward as trainer. I think of the dramatic difference Steward made for Wladimir Klitschko and Lennox Lewis, protecting them from their weaknesses without restraining their power.
Wilder has been powerful and courageous but the combination of low mass-size and amateurish technique made him very vulnerable as he got up against better fighters.
Lewis and Wlad wanted to learn. Wilder post about 2016 always gave me vibes or not really caring about getting better because he briefed he would knock anyone out. His style actually regressed
The detractors will say what they want. But this is the dude that got me back into boxing. Much love to this guy, but he needs to hang it up. You overachieved, in the books you’ve touched greatness. Hold your head high and enjoy retirement.
Worst part of Wilders career ending like this is now I have to deal with delusional British fans forever who think AJ would have ever survived more than 3 rounds against him
I don't think he deserved the disrespect. Dude's an all time great in my books. He just wanted to treat his daughter, and his will and determination got him so much farther than his humble desire. He showed up when the world needed an American in the Heavyweight division. He is the very definition of the word, American. He is Rocky but more American. He's from Alabama. And he's not fictional character.
The disrespect really flowed during the whole Fury trilogy as if he was supposed to win easily against Tyson Fury, which in 2 of those fights, he could've won, if it was anyone else other than the Gypsy King. Klitschko can't even say that about himself in his performance versus Fury.
Really great article, this, that puts Wilder's career into perspective. Nice ending paragraph: "Wilder never quite achieved the all-time greatness his Bomb Zquad cultists proclaimed, nor was he quite as bad as insisted by the armchair critics who vastly outnumbered them. In the end he was a country kid who extracted as much as possible from his natural talent, went from rags to riches, brought loads of excitement for more than a decade to a heavyweight division that needed it and left an indelible mark on the sport. In a cruel trade where happy endings are few and far between, that’s plenty good enough."
I also give Wilder credit for repping Alabama, a state that’s shit on not only by Americans but other countries as well so I’m sure it felt good for a lot of Alabama natives to have a guy like Wilder in the limelight.
My car broke down in Tuscaloosa and a network of locals looked out for us for about a week and helped us get a room and scrap my car so we could get a bus home. They were really proud of their college there
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You realize that like 26% of Alabama is black right? That's more than double the U.S. national average
Damn that's crazy, I wonder why so many black people live in the deep south
Almost like slavery was mostly there or something
Cool stats bro, still Alabama
Have you ever been or talking out of your ass?
The government of Alabama had a day off today to honor the birthday of Jefferson Davis, the confederate president. [Literally today.](https://www.al.com/news/2024/06/alabama-state-offices-are-closed-today-for-another-confederate-holiday.html)
but the 26%
What the other guy said
Damn that must be because they really love living there.
They’re really not that racist in Alabama…there’s suburbs in Long Island New York much more racist than Alabama
Yes they are I went to school in Alabama for a year and a half they literally call black people Mondays and have secret racist lyrics to classic country songs
South Carolina calls Black people "Canadians" as code in the restaurant industry
"Mondays" is a racist word for black people?
Because “nobody likes Mondays”
> They’re really not that racist in Alabama lol
Part of my family is from Alabama. I've lived in 11 states. Alabama is absolutely the most racist. I've lived in many southern states and AL is a whole different beast. I can tell stories If you want.
Both places buddy
Oh they are. As someone who lives in Georgia going down a bit further its night and day.
I don’t like when people shit on Alabama, there’s a lot of good people there trying and i feel bad for the ignorant people who get fooled by politicians, even they deserve better. Im from California but its real small minded to crap on them, the political situation isn’t so simple.
"political" and "simple" should never be in the same sentence. It's literally built to confuse.
I always give Alabama massive props for not being Mississippi.
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
The article rightfully states "What if he’d come from a boxing hotbed instead of a backwater with a negligible record for producing quality fighters?" I don't think enough people give him credit for making it this far while coming from the middle of nowhere. Terrance Crawford coming from Omaha doesn't get enough credit either. Rarely do boxers just emerge from nowhere. You have to grow up fighting in the amateurs surrounded by good fighters in NY, Detroit, Chicago, LA, etc to get really good while really young. Location matters. Uzbekistan is currently seeing a huge rise in professional fighters after having several successful amateur years.
You also need a boxing family too. Like so many of the popular ones like teofimo, haney, Mayweather, canelo all come from boxing dads.
You could pick up boxing at 14-15 and some of these kids could have almost a decade of experience on you already. You hear about Lomachenko dad teaching him footwork before how to punch. Incredible
That's most skill sports. If you look at any successful QB it's very likely they've been doing QB camps paid for by their rich parents since they were kids. Then those kids compete with kids who showed up and joined the team in 9th grade. I do BJJ and almost every big name athlete from this current generation are either 2nd or 3rd generation or their parents pulled them out of school and moved and "homeschooled" them and sent them to a top gym all day.
Inoue too.
Bro I grew up in the midwest/ south out in the country and always wanted to box growing up. The closest gym was like 1.5 hours a way in some church, probably not even a legit gym. U def. need to be near a big city.
This is one big reason why small countries like Cuba and Uzbekistan and Ireland do so well at Olympic boxing: even small towns have at least one boxing gym. I live in Ireland and you are never more than 10 miles from a gym. Even a town of 25k people here might have 2 or more gyms sometimes.
That's dope. One of my friends dads claimed he used to fight and showed us some stuff. Might have been BS.
A lot of cousins/married couples made proud by Wilder.
Spot on summary of Wilder. He was a genetic freak with the ultimate equaliser which allowed him to overachieve. He also had a ton of heart. There was no quit in him and that gave us a brilliant 3rd fight with Fury and memorable knock outs of Ortiz. Let’s also give him props for taking the fights with Parker and Zhang whilst being at the end of his career. I don’t think we’ll ever see an enigma quit like Wilder in the heavyweight division again.
Precisely, what made him so damn entertaining was his defying all boxing snobs and convention. Because his sheer power, and athleticism and a durable chin just over ruled everything. It's a shame to see him now as he's nothing like the fighter he was 10 years ago... Some fighters age like fine wine like foreman...wilder seems to have aged terribly. It happens. Personally I'd like to see him crush a can one more time before he leaves but wish him well, I gather he's mulling over having one more fight as turki will offer him one more, so best of luck to him with whatever he decides.
Wilder seemed to begin second-guessing himself during & in the fights following Fury-sequel .. and for a fighter with the style of Wilder that is apocalyptic
Yet he didn't second guess vs Helenius. People really aren't giving Parker and Zhang enough credit here.
He definitely did second-guessed himself before the Helanius KO. Everyone I was watching with thought he looked scared until he dropped him then he got credit for setting it up with his legs as something new. However, two fights later and dude is clearly shook and got lucky Helanius ran into his fist. The fact he said "I still got it" to someone in the crowd after should have been taken more seriously at the time
But thats the point: Helenius was easy to tag and couldn't take Wilders shot. Parker and Zhang could. Wilder absolutely landed power shots on Zhang and Parker. The fact they shook it off was the difference. Wilders power has always been somewhat exagerrated: His world title fights lasted an avg of 8 rounds for example. It's not like he was destroying everyone in 30 seconds, as some people seem to think Let's be real, no one was saying Wilder was done after Helenius. Let's remember Parker was seen by some as an underdog.
At the time, no one thought he was done. However, in hindsight he fought like one round in two years, cried after KOing the guy in that fight, and was filming a reality show before the Saudis offered him 10mil. He was definitely moving like a finished fighter 🤷♂️
This is a really bad and revisionist take. Wilder was a shit, shit fighter in almost every way, but his power was otherworldly. He didn't land any meaningful right hands at the correct range on either Zhang or Parker and his fights went "long" on average because he sucks and doesn't land clean punches hardly ever. It is all glancing blows and misses intersped with long periods of waiting to uncoil at all. The power was real and historic. If it wasn't, he never even would have been a pro fighter at all let alone achieve what he did. It is just too bad he started so late and/or wasn't some super coordinated natural athlete. I would go as far as to say the Wilder had the most power I have ever seen and I have been obsessing over the fight sports since the early 90s as a kid.
Heres why I disagree. In literally all his totel fights, he lands right hands flush way before the KO. Excluding Parker and Zhang did an excellent job of shutting down Wilders very limited attacks (which too many people since Saturday seem to be giving them zero credit for btw) he caught all those guys flush. Chris Arreola has said Vitali hit harder than Wilder. Wilder has faced 3 in shape skillful HWs and failed to knock any of them out over 5 fights. If Wilder was fighting a Molina type guy last Saturday instead of Zhang, are you seriously telling me he wouldn't have KO'd them? He almost certainly would have. You cannot say Wilder has GOAT power when he's only knocked out guys who had been dropped and or KO'd multiple times, before and after, most of whom had near zero defence, and many of whom took multiple right hands from Wilder before the finish.
I would not be at all surprised if Helenius had been leaned on by the promoters to take a dive to restore Wilder's confidence/career stock
It would be sick if he went down to bridger weight and just started crushing cans for a few years
Unfortunately I wish you were correct but the truth is the man is fighting elite boxers now, he’s fighting someone who can punch and box in Zhang, he’s fighting Joseph Parker who has a good chin fast hands good movement, he’s fighting Fury a 7 foot bear moth. Maybe if he would’ve fought Wlad and Povetkin after winning the WBC you’d be right but really he was protected and didn’t defy shit.
Nah he did v well against fury in 2 fights, much much better than dillian whyte. Wilders either nowhere near as good as dillian whyte or he's better. Imo 2015 wilder was far better than dilian whyte. I never claimed wilder was on prime oovetkin or wlad level. Because he wasn't. But he was damn good, most folk haven't watched old school deontay wilder fights. They're casuals who started watching him when he was older and more washed.
They have not because it’s against meaningless opposition. When your marquee win is Stiverne over 30 fights, that’s hard to argue that was your prime.
Areola and duhaupas aren't complete trash fighters tbh. Neither is ortiz. Anyway I done debating with wilder haters. It's over. I personally hope he comes back and ends on a win but if not he's had a great career.
We’re talking about HW champions and your defense is that Areola and Duhaupas aren’t complete trash. Enough said.
Lmaooo
A lack of fundamentals will always haunt you in this sport as you get older
People are over emphasising too much Wilder aging. The reality is best version of Wilder still almost certainly loses to Parker and Zhang. They had spot on tactics to take away Wilders space, which then vastly reduces how effective his right hand is. And that's wilders only weapon. His step up on quality was a massive reason he lost. If Wilder fought another Molina type fighter last weekend, he woulda KO'd them. I don't get how people are saying Wilder aged horribly when he smoked Helenius in 1 round post Fury.
Giving up 40lbs+ gets harder the older you get.
It's a nice piece. I've really enjoyed the post-Wlad period of the HW division, and I don't get the constant shitting on the top fighters in the division. It's been a fun ride with lots of great fights. There's an alternative universe where Wilder never goes into that gym, never starts fighting. That universe has a less interesting HW division from 2015-2022.
Hype around Wilder vs Joshua then the Wilder and Fury trilogy basically paved the ways for the Saudis to save it
Would have been the Luis Ortiz era instead.
If there was an Ortiz era I’d call it the Mesozoic
Or Povetkin maybe would have had a little run. One of my favorites from the era.
I will not stand this Bermane Stiverne erasure
LOL.
Lol
I feel people dump on top fighters because what makes them exciting is also what makes them easier to criticise: Their weaknesses Let's be real Wilder was dramatic to watch as much because of his many flaws as his punching power. You never knew if he was going to KO someone or get KO'd himself or schooled over 12. Guys like Vitali were wat less dramatic because they had sleds weaknesses, and so their was never as much jeopardy or drama in those fights.
I guess I fall into the armchair critic camp then but we definitely didn't outnumber the Bomb Zquad cultists at every point in his career. I remember being vastly outnumbered when I said he was overrated when people thought he'd beat some of history's greats after beating Ortiz. Wilder has undoubtedly been entertaining though and I enjoyed his fights very much. A great addition to this era but one of the most overrated fighters of this era.
Call me a cultist then because I think in his prime his power would have made him a threat against anybody.
Here's why that's a terrible take: You or I have never once seen Wilder beat a HW with good skills who was in shape. Never once. You cannot compare the Z tier guys Wilder mostly fought to great or even good HWs of bygone eras. They are galaxies apart. You simply cannot extrapolate how Wilder does vs genuinely good in shape HWs, because he never actually beat one. The only good skillful on shape HWs he fought, he failed to beat. And his loses were all very one sided.
Wow, I’ve never heard this angle before
Not sure if this was sarcasm, but let me use an analogy because many people who watch boxing don't always get the technical parts of the sport. Say you see 2 guys race in the park. Both have horrible running technique, but one is taller and has a longer stride. The other guy is not even in good shape. They race for 10 metres, taller guy wins, in not a very fast time. Now, imagine I told you "See that that guy who won, because he beat this out of shape short guy who had very little running technique, i am 100% certain he'd beat Usain Bolt in 100m" You'd laugh at me, right? But that's _exactly what Wilder advocates do_ when they suggest he would've KO'd a Lennox Lewis or Riddick Bowe or Vitali Klitschko simply because he KO'd a shorter, out of shape guy with little technique like Bermane Stiverne. It's just as crazy, and just as laughable. You can't point to the moon in the sky and then say you know as much about Astrophysics as Neil Degrasse Tyson.
Anybody who stands still with zero head movement.*
Like famous stationary target Tyson Fury for example
Ah, you’re right. That famous trilogy where Wilder beat Fury. It’s heavyweight boxing. Anyone is a ‘threat’ to anyone.
That power puncher's dice roll chance is not something any of the great heavyweights have ever built a career on, even though plenty of the greats have had it. Yes, he could hit, but landing was always a lottery. He also showed a *lot* of heart and grit in the Tyson Fury fights, but he's a very mediocre talent with limited ring intelligence, if we're talking top 30-40 all time, who made the most of his limited talents. He's also aged badly (perhaps because of being demolished by Fury) and has a difficult body type/base weight - in this fight he looks like a small cruiser, way under weight. He actually looked to be in great shape, but not for a boxing match against someone like Zhang. Hopefully he quits and stays retired - he's the sort of fighter who decides to make a comeback in 2 years and it goes very badly.
He hasn't aged well but I'm not talking about 38 year old Wilder when I say that. I also think people overlook his skills because while he has never been a technician of any sort, he does more to set up his power than just randomly throw and hope it lands. Really, he was a fascinating fighter because he was so confident in his power that none of his work went into winning rounds, but there's a reason he was able to land on everybody until recently.
Tbf critics like you have had to age wilder out to be able to crush him. He's aged terribly and would have fared much much much better against parker and zhang 10 years ago.
His losses to Fury took more from him than age did. He would have done better against Parker and Zhang 10 years ago but, given they're probably the 2nd and 3rd best guys he's faced, there's a better than good chance he'd still have lost.
True, but name an athlete over 36 that relied on his athleticism Fury III was his last act unless he could learn to box in two years. Kobe and Jordan relied on their fadeaway rather than jumping out the gym at that age. Wilder never learned his version of the fadeaway and hit the wall insanely hard when he wasn't a god among men anymore.
He would not. Parker and Zhang did a great job of taking us space, which if you boxed you know means that really nerfed Wilders right. People are giving Parker and Zhang far too little credit here. 2024 Wilder would still KO most HWs. They don't seem to get you cannot compare a Parker to a Molina or a Zhang to a Washington. Those guys are light years apart.
no they didn’t. The arguments against Wilder have never changed.
It's true though, wilder has never had good footwork or fundamental ls. It's just he was able to defy that with his power, athleticism and chin durability before. Now he's washed and old and doesn't have any of that you haters get to have a field day. I'll repeat wilder would have beaten zhang and Parker 10 years ago.
I don't get people that argue otherwise,like just watching his old fights you can see that he did have shit techinque but as you said he was faster,his punches were faster,more powerful,he had intention of killing his opponent before,he took punches better aswell. We all know he was never better skill-wise but you can't deny that he was phisically and mentaly stronger back then. 7,8 years ago,Parker and Zhang get KO'd just like everyone else and these same people would be saying they are just cans that Wilder crushed like the rest of the guys on his record.
No they wouldn’t just like no one equivalent got KO’d back then because his best wins for 5y as a champion still are against a 97yo Ortiz who was beating him over all rounds but was just too old to keep the pace. If 38yo Wilder is shot I’d love to see what you have to say about 41yo Ortiz at the time.
Agree completely. If you've followed wilders entire career like I have. I actually saw him fight in Beijing...then you'd know he used to be a different animal. He had muscles on his muscles, huge back, freakish arm speed in ring. And moved far quicker and on his feet to cut space. Was far more aggressive, and more dominant. His punches had far more accuracy. And he just carried this invincible aura. He could go and bully a guy like parker or zhang before. No chance now because he's so frail. He looks ill these days...
He aged himself out but hiding across the Atlantic. He was protected because his team knew when he stepped up he'd get found out.
You know, when it's put like that, it's not so bad.
[удалено]
Wilder fighting at CW would have been the dumbest career move possible He'd have been fighting Usyk, Breidis, Gassiev, Doriticos and Hunter for peanuts around the time he was becoming HW champion. He'd quite possibly have never been a World Champ Wilder has almost never faced opponents 40-60lbs heavier than him. Since Audley Harrison (can't be arsed to check back any further and before then it's real low level stuff) most opponents were within 10lbs of him (he was low to mid 220s), the odd one is 20lbs heavier like Arreola and Ortiz, and one, Stiverne, was 30lbs heavier Very few fighters have had to overcome such a weight discrepancy in a world title fight, not because it's so difficult to do, but because it's very rare for a world champion to weigh that much. Even still, it's happened before, particularly the 40lbs for Fury, that's happened loads, some off the top of my head, but I'm sure there is loads more - HW world title fights where the Victor weighed more than 40lbs less than their opponent: Max Baer Vs Primo Carnera (54lbs) Anthony Joshua Vs Andy Ruiz (46lbs) Ibragimov Vs Shannon Briggs (52lbs) Jack Dempsey Vs Jess Willard (58lbs) Evander Holyfield Vs George Foreman (49lbs) Obviously if we look outside world title fights, like the Zhang fight was, there are 100s, if not 1000s of examples
I’m really getting tired of these people who have no idea about fighting or sports saying things like ‘he never had much skill other than his right.’ You think it’s easy to be one of the top 3 olympians in any sport or hold the WBC belt for a near record title defenses? That means out of the 6 billion people on earth, NO ONE could beat him for years . These people couldn’t have done anything physical their whole life to understand the concept of making the pro or even division 1 level at any sport . ‘Oh but he didn’t fight anyone.’ Really ???? Who did Mike Tyson fight? Not bowe, oh yea Holyfield and Lewis for an 0-3 title and got ko’d by people who were NOT ranked in his last two fights within 6 rounds- and Tyson was younger than wilder! Both 38
I read it this morning and thought it was a fair and balanced article. He can be proud of his career, yes it was padded with plenty of knockouts over tomato cans, but he exceeded expectations given his relatively limited skillset and had 10 world title defenses. Nothing to be ashamed of, except perhaps his bizarre outbursts and excuses.
I don’t like “what ifs” regarding boxer ability but Wilder without his power is just another tomato can. Wilder to me is an experiment showing how far somebody could get if they only had one punch in their arsenal.
Maybe I’m getting ahead of myself here but I genuinely don’t think we’ll ever see a heavyweight champion like Wilder again tbh, a guy with barely any technical fundamentals and just one punch. It’s like something from a video game. Dude was fortunate to box in this era.
I agree, I understand he wasn’t boxing any and everyone but for a dude with no skill and experience he sure was beating a lot of career boxers. He also doesn’t get enough credit for his Fury fights even if he lost. The alleged best heavyweight ever was having trouble with a guy that could only throw one punch.
Still funny to think Fury struggled more with Wilder than he did with other „top“ boxers like Whyte or Wlad, Fury struggled more with Wilder than fucking Wlad 😭. Granted Wlad woudlve killed Wilder had they fought but styles make fights
Fury lost his fancy movement and couldn't run away or move efficiently like he did before his suspension. He had to stand his ground more because of that
Wilders not always been as bad as his critics would love him to be. He was 10 times the fighter he is today 10 years ago. It's just you lot and casuals only started to pay attention to him when he was in his mid 30s. Ive followed his entire career.
Wilder's first fight vs Stiverne where he actually had to be technical because of his broken hand and before he fell in love with his power completely is his best performance imo. Like seriously compare the way he used his jab in that fight to the last 5 years
I think his fight v duhaupas is his most rounded technical display of inside fighting. That was in 2015. His boxing game went to sh** shortly after that and he just paced the ring looking for the bomb.
Yup, he used to just be so much quicker and explosive than everyone that his lack of technique didn't matter because his reflexes were absolutely insane and she would just throw it and beat you to it
He was the unfortunate two big of a risk to fight in his younger years but couldn't get the right marketing to become a major name to get the fights. Everyone talks about the belt no one talks that a WBC champ who knocks out everyone couldn't get PPV main event. Unfortunately, Shelley Finkle put him with Mark Breland rather than Freddy Roach which had he'd been in Wildcard Gym he would've gained more of a bigger following than he had just because he was near Manny and others at Wildcard at the time.
To be honest, he probably would have been better in past eras because he likely grows up wanting to be Ali rather than dreaming of catching touchdowns/dunking for the Crimson Tide
Roy Jones Jr. and Ali wouldn't have accomplished much without their speed/reflexes either, they also had pretty poor fundamentals which they covered up with their speed advantage.
Don't forget the quick twitch muscles and insane reach Dude never learned to box because his straight used just beat people to the punch until about 36 off the strength of his reflexes and natural speed
Yeah wilder has bad habits and fundamentals but he knew his game But it's a big what if If he actually did work on basics like footwork
I was just about to say: with all due respect, the guy has a lot to be ashamed of, like forty different things actually, and they all happen to be excuses
I’ve always been conflicted with Wilder as a person. I remember how he comforted Luis Ortiz after his loss to Andy Ruiz and thinking he was a solid dude. Then you hear about some of his out of ring antics and his failure to accept his loss to Fury and it makes you rethink his character. Either way, he’s an athlete and an entertainer and he delivered a lot of quality content for the boxing world.
I'm generally more forgiving of salty losers in combat sports than other sports because of how brutal and mentally draining this sport is
He was making excuses when he lost the One Chip Challenge lol.
That was funny tho
Tbf he only made excuses for his loss to Fury, unlike to Parker and Zhang who were nice to him for the most part, compare this to Fury who’s just a fucking prick 😂
He didn't even make excuses after the 3rd Fury fight he just didn't show him respect afterwards
He just has a burning hatred for Fury specifically. Maybe I’m wrong but there’s something funny imagining he would only make these excuses for a guy like Fury
I mean Fury is an asshole I can appreciate his skill but he is a massive jerk and he only did that in the 2nd Fury fight after putting up virtually no resistance. I think he was more upset he didn't put up a good effort and he put up all his effort in the 3rd fight so he felt he didn't have to make anymore excuses. I'm a huge Deontay but all the excuses after the 2nd fight upset me as a fan. He never did before or since but unfortunately that's gonna be apart of his story now but I think the kos and great fights will drown it out with time
He made the excuse to keep the promotion he was on thin ice with Al Haymon and needed to keep his name in the press. The excuses for him seem to be the right route be he started to believe them.
Was he still with pbc for the 3rd Fury fight
Yes because he took that fight to court, I don't think you understand the whole thing. PBC placed him on his first PPV which in their minds was a KO of Fury that didn't happen. His second fight against Ortiz did not sell, so it was back to the second Fury fight. When he lost he had to come up in his mind with millions of excuses for why a rematch should take place and had to take it to arbitration to get the third fight. And the third fight sold not as well as the second but he won many over with the amount of heart he put in. However the fight was still a negative in sales and Al decided if he was anything like Mayweather or Tank a fight against a no name like Helenius would sell at least 150k and that fight sold 75k. His promoters quietly got rid of him which led him to Turki for the Saudi fights.
What out ring antics? Apart from fight week or when he's close to a fight and in kill mode (this energy has been missing for the last 2 fights) I've heard he a really good guy.
He allegedly choked out a prostitute in Las Vegas. I say allegedly but I’m pretty sure he was arrested for it, and his reasoning was she tried to steal his wallet
Firing Mark Breland for throwing in the towel was pretty scummy. Guy was just looking out for Wilder and ended up losing his job because of it.
his brother exposed that wilder was sleeping with his wife. pretty disgusting thing to do if true.
Also every boyfriend his daughter had, had to spar him lmfao
Sounds like a death wish but sounds like he’s really protective 😂
Fuuuuuck that I’ll just find a new gf lol
The one I always think of was Wilder falsely accusing the salsa dancer of being a “traitor” in this game show, being proven wrong, and literally breaking down bawling because he felt so awful he had accused someone incorrectly. Was so incredibly weird to see
He’s a sore loser so he’s a bad person??
Accusations that someone else cheated to the point of poisoning him and inventing insane conspiracies doesn’t make him a bad person but it does show you he’s lost touch with reality
Yeah… I agree. I don’t know why ppl have to go as far as questioning if he’s a good person though. He’s a sore loser. Boxing is littered with them. There are actual bad ppl in the sport to hate… Wilder gets too much in my opinion
I think boxers on Reddit get too caught up in bad/good people shit... People will say Teo is a bad person but rep Tank One of them is a woman beater and another one talks a lot of trash. Being annoying is not being a BAD person. MMA fans do this too
In a sport filled with violence and heartbreak, he started late to be able to afford medication for his daughter’s condition. Idk how people can hate a guy like that.
What proof is there that he’s a good person lol He’s been vocal about wanting a body on his record, he talks about murdering people like it’s nothing. I can’t imagine anyone from my friends and family saying something like that. Can you?
He's an asshole because he beats women and his own brother, and cheated on his wife with his brother's girlfriend. Also said he wanted to kill people in the ring, and is dumber than a bag of hammers. I'm sure he can be nice and what he did for his daughter is incredible, but he's done quite a lot of not- great sh\*t.
Why are you putting words in people's mouths?
He’s “conflicted with him as a person” because of his “failure to accept his loss to Fury” How am I putting words in his mouth for properly comprehending what he wrote? Why are you being hostile?
Where did he say he's a bad person?
You read his post, dude.. go argue with someone else
I can't speak for everyone, but Wilder/Fury I was so intense and entertaining that it got me back into boxing. Since I have followed the sport closer than I have ever have. I thought Wilder had his chances in all 3 fights, really, more so 1 & 3. He was seconds away in one... his role in that fight, for me, I'm sure there are other fights like that in different eras that relate, but I really feel that fight was the catalyst to the surge the Heavyweight division has seen in popularity.
He may not have ever been the greatest technical boxer in the world, but he got American's back into watching the heavyweight division and having an interested in it again after 20 years! You can never take that away from him.
Entertaining as all hell. Every fight you're at the edge of your seat because he might knock a mf out any moment
Wasn't the greatest technical gifted boxer around but man the dude gave you some great entertaining fights, he's earned millions he should hang his gloves up and ride into the sunset and look after his family.
> If he’d come about in the first half of the 20th century, before boxing’s gradual retreat toward the margins of American life, there’s no question Wilder would have been one of the country’s most famous athletes. These days a fighter needs a special something to truly cross over into the cultural mainstream, but not even Wilder’s made-for-YouTube knack for separating opponents from their senses was enough. Outside the ropes he wasn’t stylish. His Alabama drawl was mistaken for dim-wittedness. Not even Wilder’s knockout-friendly approach was enough for him to become a truly reliable box office attraction, a fact that Fury needled him with relentlessly and with cruel intentions. All of it created a chip on his shoulder which only grew as the years passed. It wasn't his drawl it was his horrendous promotion until Stiverne 2. There is zero reason why Wilder could not have at least achieved like Gervonta Davis level PPV buy numbers.
The promoters never believed in him he was supposed to just be a sideshow attraction. Tommy Morrison had more news during his HIV related comeback.
I always had fun with him. When he was knocking mfs out he was fun, when he took an L and blamed it on gypsy magic he was fun, even his most recent L was fun in the way he spun in a damn circle before going down
I don't care what any of these armchair boxing experts say, he contributed a lot to a sport and to a division that needed some excitement. I honestly thought he was done when he took on Ortiz (twice!) but he has some very solid wins over solid competition in the last part of his career before falling off a cliff. He should be very proud of his career, what he accomplished, and what he did for his family.
Easily my favorite athlete of the last decade Thanks for the memories
Him hitting a euro step on Stiverne mid combo will forever be my favorite boxing moment lol
That 2nd stiverne was funny as fuck
I really think he’ll be the last great American heavyweight we see for a very long time. Jared Anderson is less exciting as time goes by. There are a few others but all look weak. More young kids big enough to be a good HW get out into football or basketball. One will come along eventually but it’s sad compared to what the US once produced.
I mean we are eating in the lower weights
Yeah, too small for football/basketball will eat until soccer finally breaks through
Combat sports and Soccer are the few sports were height doesn't matter as much bit their are short guys in football
There's cornerbacks and that's about it Most short guys in football are too bulky for boxing
Yeah and you have to be big in football in combat sports you don't have to have as much muscle you do need it but not as much
That’s because it’s full of guys too short to play Basketball and Football
Yeah but it working tho
I think he didn't help himself with all the conspiracies about the fury losses, how he treated Breland, and saying he wanted to kill someone in the ring. Made him really unlikable. But good for him getting some money.
Yeah, article talks about that a bit. I agree with the writer that a lot of the "body on the record" stuff was him trying to lean into a persona that didn't really suit him, and was all a front for promotion that backfired.
I definitely felt that. He would try to talk slick and be a villain when his highlights sold themselves. Usually came off as not a good speaker.l 7th Bomb squad and to this day caught on though. Honestly the catch a body stuff and excuses are lame but whatever, the breland thing us real bad. Saying that he tampered with his drink. And he should be thanking him for stopping the fight.
The reason was Haymon was attempting to get rid of him after the first Fury fight as it was a big cost and had lowered his marketability. Breland stopping the fight showed everyone Deontay couldn't beat Fury. Deontay busted his ass to win but the second failure in the third Fury fight mentally destroyed him.
Hes such an odd guy, he’s not good but he’s it exactly bad, the sacrifices he made for his daughter are commendable, I mean putting yourself in a sport where you could die or more likely end up with just CTE just so you can support your family is a pretty good reason. I mean he’s still heavily flawed but so are most boxers for some reason, ig the CTE really affected their way of thinking
Dude is a weird case. He’s said a lot of dumb shit that’s made him unlikeable. But I remember when he did JRE, I came away from that a fan of him. He was super genuine and seemed like a solid decent dude.
Wilder is awesome. I'll read this later.
If we get just one more fight from Wilder before he retires I actually hope it’s against Whyte. There was a lot of bad blood against them a few years ago as Wilder refused to face Whyte when he was mandatory for like 36 years whilst WBC protected him. At that time it was an exciting fight for me as Whyte was slowly making his way back to the top. Let them settle it. Plus they’ve both dropped out of the top ~5 and I would probably rank them around the same level. I see zero reason for AJ vs Wilder after the last two performances we’ve seen from him.
Wilder needed a really good trainer…at least a decade ago. It would have made all the difference. He may never have become a boxing great but with his power and good training, he would have been difficult to beat as easily as Parker or Zhang did. Having said that, if my aunt had whiskers, she would have been my uncle
If nothing else, he took his limited skills and earned himself an Olympic bronze, a world championship, and millions. All while somehow convincing a certain chunk of fans that he was the greatest HW in the past 30 years. Unfortunately he held up the division and ran from quality opponents until he no longer could. And since taking quality opponent he has lost 4 of 5 fight and been knocked out 3 times. I probably wouldn't of had as much a problem with him if it wasn’t for his delusional fans, ridiculous excuses, and the fact he threw Mark Breland under the bus. Trashing him and attempting to destroy his reputation.
You all are here talking like he’s dead or retired. You don’t realize that he’s going to fight again and the story ain’t completely over yet. Yes we’re on the last chapter, but there’s still a a few pages left to go before the ending.
I thought that Wilder would be the one to have Tank's status because of the division he's in, his KOs and Olympic pedigree. In hindsight whoever promotes him really failed to capitalized his potential popularity-wise
I've always known that AJ and Fury were better, but I'm not going insane wondering why people rated Wilder highly back then. He was a dangerous fighter that fell short of truly elite-- no more no less Despite some missed opportunities, Wilder was a great addition to this generation of HW and I'll miss him
The problem for Deontay started with his insane excuse after Fury 2. Most people knew he was limited. "Windmill" has been a joke about Deontay since before 2015. But most people just had a problem with him not improving and knowing it would hurt him once he truly stepped up. But they didn't really have a problem with Deontay as a person. When he went crazy after Fury 2 including literally blaming his corner, his costume, Fury's cheating, etc, etc, people started to also have a problem with him as a person. Had Deontay never gone down that dark corner, I think most would be kinder with his legacy. They'd still say he never had a signature win and was limited, but it would be followed with "a good dude that made what he had work for him to get him farther than he should have." But once the "good dude" thing went away, people just plain wanted to see him kicked to the curb. I didn't even have a problem with the "get me a body" talk as I wrote it off as promotion talk. Promo talk that went too far, but I never thought he was serious. Deontay would do himself a world of good if he retired and in his farewell speech, he owns up that he was under severe emotional stress and wishes he could take back his actions after Fury 2. And specifically asking Breland for forgiveness.
His defense is... he tends to move straight back. Not good .
Getting into boxing at 19 and winning an Olympic medal a few years later is insane no matter how you look at it.
One thing I don’t see mentioned enough here is that, for Deontay Wilder to have taken up boxing late, not have had developed a legitimate technical offense, win a world heavyweight championship that he defended ten times, he HAD to have been an amazing .1% athlete. Known to all great athletes, Father Time is undefeated. From pathos to ire and a spectrum of spectator feelings everywhere between, Deontay Wilder might truly be one of a kind. That’s worth celebrating.
>But it wasn’t long before the gnawing memories of his sporting prowess led him down a dirt road off a quiet offshoot of Route 30 these journos think they are Stephen King doing some world building
That seems like a fine sentence to me.. how do you want your sports articles to be written? “Deontay Wilder then had interest in boxing. He trained at boxing. He got good at boxing. Some thought he was better than he was. Some thought he was worse than he was. He said some controversial things. He was exciting. The end”
Deontay Wilder was interested in boxing from a very young age.
British journos are all repressed authors
Bryan Armen Graham is from the US.
All journos are repressed authors?
Accidental 💀
He did good by himself and his family, but he also held up the division even worse than Fury did. The division should have been unified two or three times before it was, but Wilder either ducked (Klitschko, Joshua) or forced rematches when he really shouldn't have for his own sake (Fury III). I could excuse that a bit if he actually did good things with his strap, but all he did was fight gatekeeper level guys, Ortiz, and cherry pick gone wrong in Fury. I think he overall hurt the sport and is emblematic of the issues of his era of boxing. Nothing against him as a person, though.
IMO Best thing he did was trash talk fury to get off the couch. He does seem to possess the touch of death though which eliminated a lot of top 15-10 level. Didn’t hang in long enough to get matched against Usyk or Joshua. Was fun when those three names were being tossed around. Very heartwarming personal story but overshadowed by blaming heavy walkout dress and armor in Furt fight.
>*“If I don’t make any right decisions no more in my life, I can say at least I done it one time.”* Nah, it's just something in my eye...
Read this yesterday and thought it was a great article about his career.
Wilder went down hill when he dropped Breland.
I can't help but wonder what Deontay Wilder would have been if he had someone like the late Manny Steward as trainer. I think of the dramatic difference Steward made for Wladimir Klitschko and Lennox Lewis, protecting them from their weaknesses without restraining their power. Wilder has been powerful and courageous but the combination of low mass-size and amateurish technique made him very vulnerable as he got up against better fighters.
Lewis and Wlad wanted to learn. Wilder post about 2016 always gave me vibes or not really caring about getting better because he briefed he would knock anyone out. His style actually regressed
The detractors will say what they want. But this is the dude that got me back into boxing. Much love to this guy, but he needs to hang it up. You overachieved, in the books you’ve touched greatness. Hold your head high and enjoy retirement.
Never skip leg day
This dude has too many haters. I think his career was great and he gave us some great fights and sick highlights
Worst part of Wilders career ending like this is now I have to deal with delusional British fans forever who think AJ would have ever survived more than 3 rounds against him
Jesus fucking Christ. Yeah, AJ definitely wouldn't have lasted more then 3 but Szplika can go 9, Duaphaus 11 and Stiverne 12...
I don't think he deserved the disrespect. Dude's an all time great in my books. He just wanted to treat his daughter, and his will and determination got him so much farther than his humble desire. He showed up when the world needed an American in the Heavyweight division. He is the very definition of the word, American. He is Rocky but more American. He's from Alabama. And he's not fictional character. The disrespect really flowed during the whole Fury trilogy as if he was supposed to win easily against Tyson Fury, which in 2 of those fights, he could've won, if it was anyone else other than the Gypsy King. Klitschko can't even say that about himself in his performance versus Fury.