There have been a lot of exciting big-name first timers in the past year or two but I'm always so relieved when a new episode pops up and the guest is an old standby like RiLaws.
Love when he does this on Little Gold Men. There's always that tiny pause as his cohosts catch up to him before they laugh and he mutters "Sorry, sorry."
Anyone who already understands the rhythms of the podcast is high on my Guest Affection list (some new guests, like Janet Varney and David Krumholtz, are able to do this, but it's far less common than an old-timer).
Two quick points:
1. I’m severely hungover and this episode is surprisingly great on that.
2. Everyone moved on too quickly after Lawson said that the writing is as if someone melted James L. Brooks’s script on a radiator. Perfect description.
Thank you! That line perfectly encapsulates the uncanniness of the movie for me. After 20 something years I have an apt description for what bugs me about this movie.
That and the severely deranged Patois scene
Around the time this movie was coming out, I knew a kid at my elementary school literally named "Joseph Black". He had a rough few weeks there, with kids teasing him about it.
I mean if I could pick the body of someone during that time, I’m not sure you could do better than Pitt. I will say, I wonder what the movie would be like if you swapped Depp for Pitt. It’s probably much weirder.
While watching this I kept fantasizing about potential fanedits to it, but the one I kept circling was one where the only difference is that the subtitles for all of Brad Pitt's lines are in small caps.
Some podcaster recently described her as having a young Meryl vibe.
She’s already got an Emmy, a Tony, an Olivier, and two BAFTAs, and I think it’s just a matter of time before she starts getting Oscar noms/wins.
My grandma was from the south side of Chicago, same generation and class as the Jodie Comer character, and she sounded pretty good to me, I think people got thrown off that nobody else in the movie was doing that accent or anything else like it.
I’m just in awe of how good Hopkins is in everything. He’s like a rube goldberg machine where he can take the tiniest scraps of good writing or ideas at the beginning and create something you just have to keep watching
So like, does the family of Joe Blacks body not know where it is? Are they worried? Did he just get up from the coroners table and walk out ?
That being said, I think that car death is meant to be funny right? Right? Riiiight ?
I would assume after the car accident, Death immediately takes over. so the onlookers just see Brad Pitt get up after the accident, brush himself off and go for a walk like nothing happened (which would've been a funny scene )
Yeah this watch I kept thinking about his sister he's on the phone to at the start. Maybe they're all in a different city and it's not uncommon to go a few days without speaking?
Assuming that when Death 'borrowed' his body it also went missing from the crash scene (so there was no call made to his bereaved family), maybe they really just didn't hear from him for the 3-4 days the movie takes place over, and then he popped up again like "hey, had a weird couple of days - anyway, who wants to meet my new girlfriend who just inherited half of her incredibly wealthy father's estate?"
It's very likely you have this exactly correct but typical for this movie, it doesn't find time in three hours to make the slightest reference to this.
Its so funny. The final cut back to Claire Forlani reveals there's a whole paramedic crew hanging out, less than 2 blocks away, as NYC traffic goes Hulkamania-going-wild all over Brad Pitt's body.
I think maybe they were laughing to hard to save him, honestly
OK, I know this accent and the scene is a joke but is it funny because his accent is bad/wrong or is it funny to people because it's just Brad Pitt doing it and it seems ridiculous? As in, if it was a more appropriate actor, let's say, in a different kind of movie, would it still seem funny?
I think it's just because he's the whitest person you can think of, and out of context it's hard to imagine what possible scenario could justify him putting on such a deeply coded dialect.
Unpopular opinion but I love when the friends cover a commonly derided film that they expect to be a stinker but end up liking against their better judgement. It’s a fun twist. Listening to their deranged takes has me like
https://preview.redd.it/8ugkfwq1a5bd1.jpeg?width=474&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7b4cb19f2fadba4ce242e0a121e6bbd2409a81d0
It is the sicko movie, but I’m glad they have this take. This was the movie that I was most looking forward to because it’s so fucking weird, but not in an interesting way. Like in a “Bicentennial Man” way where there’s all these unwell ideas. But they like it more than I ever did and it’s a refreshing take.
Also, Chris Columbus series when?
I disagree with them, but I’m glad they had fun.
I think Scent Of A Woman is as boring and formless but A) it’s several minutes shorter; and B) Al Pacino, say what you will about how hard he’s trying, is a real movie star who is turning the ending up to max and fucking UNCORKING
I thought a little more time would be spent unpacking the idea that Brad Pitt transmogrifies into like basically a demon from hell (who is around humans all the time so probably does know what peanut butter is) and then this is a love story where this girl falls in love with a demon and at the end the demon is just like "welp smell ya later, here maybe now re-fall in love with this other guy who is a completely different person whose dead body I stole and have now reanimated?" cause that won't be weird at all
The central plot of the movie has this problem where the emotional truth has a massive unresolvable disconnection. Was anyone else bothered by that?
He’s not a demon from hell though, he’s just the personification of death. Demon from hell is a torturing and evil being. Death isn’t good or bad. It’s just an elemental force like gravity. This movie is basically what if gravity was a hot guy for 3 days
They all said it was pretty clearly the best movie of 1998, and I got where they were coming from, but at one point David suggested it might be the best movie of the 20th century, and even Ben chimed in and agreed!
It's pretty high praise but they might not be wrong.
Hopkins’ character reminded me of a nicer Logan Roy, and the plot is kind of like A Christmas Carol type of situation (that’s a Succession spin off I’d like to see)
When I first watched this I was like “yes, 65 is very old, this checks out”. Now I’m like “holy shit, he is so young, my dad is ten years older than that right now.”
They mention in the episode that Ebert was one of the movie’s few defenders at the time, but was surprised they didn’t mention who else praised it: Gene Siskel. I believe Matt Singer talks about it in his great book on the two, but the discussion is well worth watching. For those who don’t know, the movie came out only a few months before Siskel’s untimely death and during a time when he knew he was dying of brain cancer - a fact he kept from almost everyone including, tragically, Ebert - and likely was metaphorically going through a similar experience as Anthony Hopkins’ character in the film.
Link: https://youtu.be/ixHV06PWjcE?si=nc9WTWP4bFkpFoiZ
I think Pitt is very good in an impossible role, esp. in the first half. But the movie is fundamentally broken and Pitt is hung out to dry a few too many times. There are definitely things he can't do here but it's a committed performance by a talented actor.
This is pretty peak Pitt hotness, though. That makes up for a lot, including that he and Forlani are so dull and have not much chemistry together, but are both so damned pretty it doesn’t matter.
That said, I’ll take a batshit Pacino and schlubby brat PSH over beautiful boredom every time.
Not only do I agree with you, I find the opposite opinion incomprehensible. Scent is deeply flawed but very interesting, this is just insane and rancid.
As someone who found both films profoundly painful to slog through, Scent of a Woman seems like a tight work of cinematic brilliance compared to this thing. Haven't heard the episode yet, but I cannot imagine how any of them have anything positive to say about it...
For whatever Rotten Tomatoes is worth, Scent of a Woman is double Meet Joe Black (85% vs 42%) so it is general conscious
I think I'm even ranking "Gigli" higher than Meet Joe Black. Just because the awfulness of "Gigli" is more interesting to me. It's weird to have the three guys being so in unison for "Meet Joe Black" being good when it seems to be a rare opinion
> It's weird to have the three guys being so in unison for "Meet Joe Black" being good when it seems to be a rare opinion
Try looking up literally any audience aggregate score for Meet Joe Black
That is so wild to me lol. Scent of a Woman was absolutely ridiculous to me and I was locked in for Joe Black the whole time. Great acting, great score, a touch of fantasy. Solid stuff!
I appreciate hearing that. *Scent* IS ridiculous. *Meet Joe Black* does have a consistency of tone.... I said to someone if you removed the dialogue track you would definitely think *MJB* was at least as good or better. It's "accomplished" and very committed to its whatever, insane premise and themes. But..... *Scent* locks together like a dumb Oscarbait-y Lego castle.
Consistency of tone?? That's a wild opinion IMO. The shifts between born yesterday almost slapstick surrealism comedy and "heartfelt" drama - the impossible task for Forlani to play a real person who also falls in love (or is simply horny for) cooky-insane-doll-boy-baby-devil-Pitt is just one of the most jarring juxtapositions I've seen.
I still think it's true, though. The look of the movie, production design.... what the music is doing in every scene, insistently nudging you to this wistful place in which nullities (every character is a nullity) can attest their love for each other over and over again. Sure, a few confrontations here and there. This is not a good movie, but it all feels like it's directed by the same person.
Add this to list of insane takes that the both of them somehow share. Sometimes I wish they’d disagree more just so I could hear someone push back a bit instead of acting like this is a common opinion.
I viscerally dislike this movie in ways I can’t fully articulate. I just find it so self indulgent with nothing actually interesting to say about life, love, etc. It’s probably in my bottom five of movies they’ve covered, definitely bottom ten, alongside Pinocchio, The Last Airbender, a few of the Burtons, and Space Jam: A New Legacy. I’d rewatch Rollerall five times before I’d watch Meet Joe Black again.
The guys being into this is maybe the prime example of Blank Check Brain. Watching a director's entire filmography and discussing it for dozens of hours leads you to think there's something interesting in a disaster like this when in fact, it is a turd. (still liked the episode)
I do kinda like that though. You can watch a movie like this in its context as a pretty bad 1998 film (which most other critics or podcasts would do) or in its context as a Martin Brest film (which is obviously what BC does). And so sure, you sometimes don't get the wider context of what people at the time thought but it makes for an interesting episode for discussion.
The thing that got me was how many lengthy pauses were splattered all over every dialogue scene like everyone's constantly saying the most profound thing on earth but it's mostly shit like "his name............................. is Joe" and "I do................................ like peanut butter"
I’ve never thought Hopkins was supposed to be American in this, didn’t detect even an attempt at an accent. Does it say he’s American at any point? Great episode, good to have RiLaws back. I also like the movie!
This really did a number on my zoomer brain. Took me 5 hours to finish. I actually don’t mind the premise. Beings of a higher power coming to grips with the simple reality they’re responsible for is always a soft spot for me, so I really wanted to like this movie, I just felt like everything was moving at .25x speed. That plus the ending threw about 300 questions at me that will never be solved. Still think it’s higher than Scent of a Woman because it’s trying something even if it’s at a glaciers pace.
First time ever seeing Meet Joe Black was a couple weeks ago and I went in cold not knowing anything except the one thing - I've spent more than 11 minutes on the internet so I was very aware that he gets ragdolled by two cars. I was not aware that that happens in like the first ten minutes. For some reason I always just assumed that's how the movie ended so it still came as a surprise to see it that early.
Also the introduction scene at dinner where Marcia Gay Harden and Jeffrey Tambor are like "YOU GOTTA NAME, SON????" "SPIT IT OUT ALREADY!!!" "JOE? JUST JOE? THAT'S IT?????" is insane. Nobody would behave like that. Not since the old woman at the end of The Last Jedi have we seen movie characters so rudely inquisitive about someone's name.
Didn't love the movie. Sorry.
I haven't seen The Waterboy in at least 20 years, but I feel confident in slightly correcting Griffin: Bobby Boucher is not a kicker, he's a linebacker. He needs to visualize people being mean to him in order to unlock his rage so he can tackle real good, not kick the football hard.
Is this the episode that will have the most Blankies disagreeing with it? Usually when the two friends advocate for a movie most people think is bad, the sub takes on tone that's like "well, it's common knowledge this is actually a good movie, they said so on a podcast", but I think even the Blankies are unwilling to meet Joe Blank.
Right? They talk about the soundtrack being great but then how it overwhelms things, they mention the pacing is bad, that a lot of it is fully insane in ways that undercut the material around it… they have very few positive things to say about the movie besides the performances.
Ironically, I felt that way particularly about these three doing Benjamin Button. At two different points in the podcast, they praise Pitt's character for two completely contradictory things, and also that the movie "stayed honest to the diary format", despite showing parts of his life in vivid detail he wouldn't have remembered or wrote down.
I heavily disagreed with the 3 of them about Benjamin Button and did not understand at all their defense of that film, but honestly, I *kinda* see where their more understanding, milder defense of MJB is coming from, even if I found it to be boring to the point of unwatchable. There are aspects to this film that are almost compelling, but it's obvious flaws really ruin it for most people. I also think it's a case of interesting premise, horrible execution.
Actually I recently rewatched The Green Mile for the first time in maybe 15 years and was shocked by how much it stinks. There's a handful of good moments though.
Did people disagree with their (primarily) positive take on Welcome to Marwen? It didn't help that episode was David, Ben, and Marie drunkenly yelling at Griffin into submission, but this sounds more controlled.
I think Marwen is a dogshit film.
Yeah the “Chris O’Donnell Fan Club” folks who downvoted me before the Scent ep dropped for a mild take about him being dull got surprisingly quiet after the ep dropped with Krumholtz positively murdering him.
Jake Weber was the only one sorta acting rationally to his boss, who earlier admitted to hearing things, bringing in this total stranger and giving him unlimited access to the company and family
One of the signs of the badness of this movie is that at least 50% of what the "villain" does is actually perfectly defensible and normal behavior. Death and taxes.....
one time i fell asleep to legends of the fall on cable and when i woke up meet joe black (also pitt & hopkins) was on. i had never seen meet joe black and i thought legends took a very insane tonal turn that i didn’t remember. especially waking up from one of those killer naps, was one of the most surreal movie watching memories i have
That reminds me of when I was a kid I fell asleep watching Lynch's *Dune* and when I woke up someone had switched the channel to *Tremors*. For a very long time I thought *Dune* ended with a bunch of local rednecks blowing up the Shai-Hulud with dynamite.
Ben playing the part of Death throughout this was so low-key but hilarious. Really felt like a classic Blank Check runner (like him playing Benbot in the *A.I. Artificial Intelligence* episode).
Also loved the effect on Griffin's voice when he started talking about Hopkins' hearing the voice in his head.
Hated the movie and was expecting to not enjoy this episode knowing they all liked it...but this was a great episode! I laughed more than I can recall on any recent listen and it feels like they stayed on topic the whole time.
Re: Discworld
Death's books were always my favorite. I've never heard of the movie Death Takes a Holiday they reference, but the plot sounds very much like Reaper Man, where Death goes on holiday as a farmer and then people stop dying.
It's from 1991, so I guess riffing on that movie was just in the air at the time?
When starting the episode: "damn I was hoping for a longer episode!"
After hearing their initial take: "thank GOD this isn't a longer episode!"
J/k and all that, you like what you like and I love people who love movies, but how this can't be immediately classified as the worst film they've ever covered is beyond me. This one I truly rancid IMO.
It's quite bad. I kind of get what they're saying, the score completes its mission of getting the viewer into a crying state. The problem is, all of the characters have brain damage.
I said on another thread that this would be better with a comedic actor as Joe Black (Jim Carrey, Robin Williams), but now I'm realizing that's just BEING THERE: A fish out of water who knows nothing of this world taken in by the family of a dying rich old man played by a legend and changes everyone's lives and disappears at the end.
And like Griffin says at the top of ep, for any other actor the Hopkins performance could be career-best work...Melvyn Douglas won an Oscar for the old guy in BEING THERE!
(maybe they bring up Being There, I'm only 10 mins in)
I think I heard Griffin briefly mention it. But Being There is 100% what I was thinking while watching it last night. Probably because Being There is so fresh to me and I also LOVED it.
In addition to what others here added, the *Being There* DNA is very weak, the movie pursues that thread only very intermittently. The *Being There* note is very specific; it's a normal question or situation responded to with maximum vagueness and then the rest of the room going "Oh! Yes indeed! I never thought of it that way! Good man!" etc. This does happen a couple times but it's more just like screenwriterly indecision than any actual theme.
I wouldn't say the movie is good, but there's a great movie in here trying to get out. I think some masterful editing could have made this a banger 2-hour flick. I think some screenwriting changes could have made this a classic.
In the first 5 minutes of the episode, they speculate that Anthony Hopkins didn't put on the werewolf makeup for The Wolfman, but according to Rick Baker, Hopkins relished that stuff. I doubt it's him doing the wirework, but he's in the makeup otherwise. As Baker tells it, they had a pretty miserable time on the movie because no one cared about the makeup effects and the studio/producers (and even Joe Johnston) were trying to do everything with CGI. The only people who cared and made the job worth it were Benicio Del Toro and Anthony Hopkins. They also had to reshoot the ending and Hopkins had lost 70 lbs, but this made the makeup even better according to this clip:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJGTY4M18lI](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJGTY4M18lI)
I, uh, liked it quite a bit lol. I don’t know why but I had a great time with it. It’s probably my second favorite Brest and I don’t see Gigli changing that lol.
I also really enjoyed MJB way more than I was expecting. I think it's the combination of Hopkins and the incredible set design - it's so expensive looking and I really enjoyed just spending time in that world.
Marcia Gay Harden is doing her best Parker Posey and Claire Forlani is styled so specifically '90's that I lost my elder millennial mind. (Her lipstick! Chinos and gray T-shirt - may as well play a GAP swing dance commercial!)
I thought Brad was bad when he was playing blank. He worked in scenes where some of his personality showed though - I didn't like the business plot but the IRS scene was hilarious because he was a character.
Anthony Hopkins is my grandmother’s cousin (or was, she has sadly passed away last year). I have never met him - I am not sure that *she* ever met him, honestly - but I have always jokingly called him “Uncle Anthony”. So hearing Richard Lawson do an impression of “Uncle Anthony” signing a fan letter was a trip!
Sorry if this is super random, but every time the main theme played in this movie I was getting V for Vendetta vibes (where V emerges from the fire in the flashback). I know they're different composers, but did anyone hear something similar?
I’m guessing Griff knows so little about sports, despite being in a football movie, that he thinks the point of football is to kick the ball hard. Of course in the Waterboy he uses his anger to tackle with great force. Though at a point his teammate does use the same logic to kick the ball.
Another thing about The Waterboy:
It really feels like the heir to Sandler’s SNL work, as so many of his characters were [something] Boy/Man.
Opera Man, Canteen Boy, the Herlihy Boy.
When they were going through other actors who could've been an alternative to Pitt I thought they would mention Depp. Joe has a bit of a Scissorhands vibe to me but Keanu definitely has the blankness that might've worked more.
Scent of a Woman & Gigli > Meet Joe Black
Would rather watch an insane person ramble than paint dry
David & Griffin might as well do a Ron Howard run now, each milquetoast movie will get a 5/5
I started Gigli yesterday and kinda liked it until I hit the roadblock that is Justin Bartha’s character and had to stop. I’ll power through and finish, but woof.
I like this movie!
The core of this movie that interests me more than Scent of a woman or Gigli is that it’s an original feeling premise with a take, I honestly could not see just anyone making this movie but Brest comes in having this fully formed take on life and death and it comes through perfectly.
I will admit that it has issues, the main one being an issue all post Midnight Run movies Brest make in which he has a subplot that could be entirely cut and the resolution of the subplot it often forgets is hollow and overly convenient. I really don’t see anything in the movie that makes Pitt knowing how to act like an IRS agent make sense. In the same vein I don’t get why Al Pacino has anything to say that’s helpful or effective in that school room courthouse scene in Scent of a Woman.
Maybe for a more ambiguous “am I supposed to like him or not” movie. Mid-90s Damon was firmly in that mode with Ripley and parts of Good Will Hunting, and an outright dick in School Ties.
I do not want to hand it to Jeffrey Tambor, given his personal shit, but I really think his Quincy performance is the most compelling part of the film. He’s the only one matching Hopkins’ acting prowess in this.
Yeah, Tambor is unfortunately really great here. Since seeing the movie a few weeks back, I often think of how he plays both the board vote scene when he realizes what he's complicit in and the scene with Pitt where he reveals how deeply he cares about Hopkins and Marcia Gay Harden. He does the heartbroken vulnerability really beautifully.
It's a take that David has thrown out before, so I at least respect the commitment to the consistency. Doesn't mean it's technically true, just from a ratings perspective, or at that it's Oscar Nomination is considered unjustified, but you like what you like, and dislike what you dislike.
Re: The Pitt/Jeffrey Tambor dummy convo
That's why the budget on F1(The Kosinski movie) is so big. They keep having to send the Tambor dummies back because they're not up to Pitt's standard!
Death may have only been alive for a few days, but *he looks a lot older*
There have been a lot of exciting big-name first timers in the past year or two but I'm always so relieved when a new episode pops up and the guest is an old standby like RiLaws.
No one better than Lawson at throwing out quick bits played completely straight.
Love when he does this on Little Gold Men. There's always that tiny pause as his cohosts catch up to him before they laugh and he mutters "Sorry, sorry."
I feel this way about almost all my favorite podcasts
Anyone who already understands the rhythms of the podcast is high on my Guest Affection list (some new guests, like Janet Varney and David Krumholtz, are able to do this, but it's far less common than an old-timer).
I have a specific RiLaws episode playlist that just got bigger :)
I think he's my GOAT guest at this point. I don't think anyone is better at batting it around with the boys.
I feel “this cheque was so blank, it was clear” deserves major comedy points.
I was hoping they’d put a trailer for The Phantom Menace episodes at the start of this episode.
“Most American not greatest American” is an incredible start to the episode.
Two quick points: 1. I’m severely hungover and this episode is surprisingly great on that. 2. Everyone moved on too quickly after Lawson said that the writing is as if someone melted James L. Brooks’s script on a radiator. Perfect description.
Thank you! That line perfectly encapsulates the uncanniness of the movie for me. After 20 something years I have an apt description for what bugs me about this movie. That and the severely deranged Patois scene
Around the time this movie was coming out, I knew a kid at my elementary school literally named "Joseph Black". He had a rough few weeks there, with kids teasing him about it.
Yeah, I remember working with a guy named John Carter a few years back when his eponymous movie came out.
For what it’s worth, I think Brad Pitt did a good job portraying an elemental force of nature hijacking the body of hot 90s Brad Pitt.
Say what you want about Death, it’s got impeccable taste.
I mean if I could pick the body of someone during that time, I’m not sure you could do better than Pitt. I will say, I wonder what the movie would be like if you swapped Depp for Pitt. It’s probably much weirder.
Me talking to my phone: “I’ve read the Discworld books, David!”
While watching this I kept fantasizing about potential fanedits to it, but the one I kept circling was one where the only difference is that the subtitles for all of Brad Pitt's lines are in small caps.
It’s official. We can all go home. Richard Lawson likes Jodie Comer’s accent in The Bikeriders.
then I guess my name is also Richard Lawson! (but I pretty much like Jodie Comer in all things)
She's a "when are they bad?" performer.
She's even good in Free Guy.
Some podcaster recently described her as having a young Meryl vibe. She’s already got an Emmy, a Tony, an Olivier, and two BAFTAs, and I think it’s just a matter of time before she starts getting Oscar noms/wins.
My family is from the Chicago burbs and she nailed a very specific accent, I was impressed!
My grandma was from the south side of Chicago, same generation and class as the Jodie Comer character, and she sounded pretty good to me, I think people got thrown off that nobody else in the movie was doing that accent or anything else like it.
Yeah, it's something where those people just live among the other Chicagoans and we don't notice.
Her accent is one of the few highlights of that movie, imo.
'Dis tread gwan be irie, mon.
Adrian Brody would have killed in this movie.
RESPECT MY NECK
Bro named his character who is going to die at the end of the movie "Will Perish"
LOST levels of character names
Gawdayum, here I was just thinking it was a vaguely religious reference, and because the guy has such a reverent following.
Shoutout to Ben for all of the great bits this series. Dude is on fire
I’m just in awe of how good Hopkins is in everything. He’s like a rube goldberg machine where he can take the tiniest scraps of good writing or ideas at the beginning and create something you just have to keep watching
argument to be made that he’s the best living actor in the English language
Did a spit-take when the echo-y Griffin voice suddenly appeared
So like, does the family of Joe Blacks body not know where it is? Are they worried? Did he just get up from the coroners table and walk out ? That being said, I think that car death is meant to be funny right? Right? Riiiight ?
I would assume after the car accident, Death immediately takes over. so the onlookers just see Brad Pitt get up after the accident, brush himself off and go for a walk like nothing happened (which would've been a funny scene )
That’s a brilliant take. Imagine watching a dude get absolutely rocked and then he just pops up and is fine.
Real Joe Black's family discovering him would be a better final act than the whole succession battle
Yeah this watch I kept thinking about his sister he's on the phone to at the start. Maybe they're all in a different city and it's not uncommon to go a few days without speaking?
Assuming that when Death 'borrowed' his body it also went missing from the crash scene (so there was no call made to his bereaved family), maybe they really just didn't hear from him for the 3-4 days the movie takes place over, and then he popped up again like "hey, had a weird couple of days - anyway, who wants to meet my new girlfriend who just inherited half of her incredibly wealthy father's estate?"
It's very likely you have this exactly correct but typical for this movie, it doesn't find time in three hours to make the slightest reference to this.
Its so funny. The final cut back to Claire Forlani reveals there's a whole paramedic crew hanging out, less than 2 blocks away, as NYC traffic goes Hulkamania-going-wild all over Brad Pitt's body. I think maybe they were laughing to hard to save him, honestly
every ting gon’ be aye-ray
OK, I know this accent and the scene is a joke but is it funny because his accent is bad/wrong or is it funny to people because it's just Brad Pitt doing it and it seems ridiculous? As in, if it was a more appropriate actor, let's say, in a different kind of movie, would it still seem funny?
I think it's just because he's the whitest person you can think of, and out of context it's hard to imagine what possible scenario could justify him putting on such a deeply coded dialect.
Unpopular opinion but I love when the friends cover a commonly derided film that they expect to be a stinker but end up liking against their better judgement. It’s a fun twist. Listening to their deranged takes has me like https://preview.redd.it/8ugkfwq1a5bd1.jpeg?width=474&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7b4cb19f2fadba4ce242e0a121e6bbd2409a81d0
Right. Next week sounds like it's going to be a "How Did This Made"-style dunk contest.
The Justin Bartha performance earned that.
It is the sicko movie, but I’m glad they have this take. This was the movie that I was most looking forward to because it’s so fucking weird, but not in an interesting way. Like in a “Bicentennial Man” way where there’s all these unwell ideas. But they like it more than I ever did and it’s a refreshing take. Also, Chris Columbus series when?
They all think this is a good movie, I'm truly shocked!
I disagree with them, but I’m glad they had fun. I think Scent Of A Woman is as boring and formless but A) it’s several minutes shorter; and B) Al Pacino, say what you will about how hard he’s trying, is a real movie star who is turning the ending up to max and fucking UNCORKING
I thought a little more time would be spent unpacking the idea that Brad Pitt transmogrifies into like basically a demon from hell (who is around humans all the time so probably does know what peanut butter is) and then this is a love story where this girl falls in love with a demon and at the end the demon is just like "welp smell ya later, here maybe now re-fall in love with this other guy who is a completely different person whose dead body I stole and have now reanimated?" cause that won't be weird at all The central plot of the movie has this problem where the emotional truth has a massive unresolvable disconnection. Was anyone else bothered by that?
He’s not a demon from hell though, he’s just the personification of death. Demon from hell is a torturing and evil being. Death isn’t good or bad. It’s just an elemental force like gravity. This movie is basically what if gravity was a hot guy for 3 days
Agreed! It’s super weird that Claire Forlani is like “Well as long as he looks like Brad Pitt, I’ll take whatever he’s offering”
I just finished the movie last night and haven't heard the ep yet, but if you're right I am also shocked. That thing sucked shit!
They all said it was pretty clearly the best movie of 1998, and I got where they were coming from, but at one point David suggested it might be the best movie of the 20th century, and even Ben chimed in and agreed! It's pretty high praise but they might not be wrong.
Hopkins’ character reminded me of a nicer Logan Roy, and the plot is kind of like A Christmas Carol type of situation (that’s a Succession spin off I’d like to see)
I was surprised to learn this movie invented the whole “what’s your name? No, what’s your LAST name?” bit from “Rise of Skywalker.”
When I first watched this I was like “yes, 65 is very old, this checks out”. Now I’m like “holy shit, he is so young, my dad is ten years older than that right now.”
Funny to realize its been 26 years and "the old man" Hopkins is still around winning oscars and stealing scenes.
Alternate version of the Brimley/Cocoon line: Tom Cruise is now older than Hopkins (not Parrish) is in this movie.
Richard Lawson, as foretold on the Benjamin Button episode!
I’ve been awaiting this moment for… well, not years but at least a couple months
“Joe Black also gets Orson Beaned” - David Sims
I had forgotten that comment until I re-listened to the episode (in preparation for another one of Pitt's weirder performances), still makes me laugh.
“Mom…Dad…I’m a little bone man.” —Richard’s impression of Button coming out
They mention in the episode that Ebert was one of the movie’s few defenders at the time, but was surprised they didn’t mention who else praised it: Gene Siskel. I believe Matt Singer talks about it in his great book on the two, but the discussion is well worth watching. For those who don’t know, the movie came out only a few months before Siskel’s untimely death and during a time when he knew he was dying of brain cancer - a fact he kept from almost everyone including, tragically, Ebert - and likely was metaphorically going through a similar experience as Anthony Hopkins’ character in the film. Link: https://youtu.be/ixHV06PWjcE?si=nc9WTWP4bFkpFoiZ
The pod is hitting the feed like Pitt hitting two cars.
The rare movie that makes me wish **I** was hit by two cars crossing the street
Let me be the first to disagree that this movie is better than *Scent of a Woman*.
Hoo-ah (agreement)!
This movie is boring. My jaw was on the floor throughout Scent of a Woman.
So funny to hear them go “Chris O’Donnell gives us nothing” one week then say “Brad Pitt gives a transcendent performance” the next
I think Pitt is very good in an impossible role, esp. in the first half. But the movie is fundamentally broken and Pitt is hung out to dry a few too many times. There are definitely things he can't do here but it's a committed performance by a talented actor.
This is pretty peak Pitt hotness, though. That makes up for a lot, including that he and Forlani are so dull and have not much chemistry together, but are both so damned pretty it doesn’t matter. That said, I’ll take a batshit Pacino and schlubby brat PSH over beautiful boredom every time.
Not only do I agree with you, I find the opposite opinion incomprehensible. Scent is deeply flawed but very interesting, this is just insane and rancid.
As someone who found both films profoundly painful to slog through, Scent of a Woman seems like a tight work of cinematic brilliance compared to this thing. Haven't heard the episode yet, but I cannot imagine how any of them have anything positive to say about it...
I feel like Griffin gives the game away when he says he can't feature himself watching this movie again.
For whatever Rotten Tomatoes is worth, Scent of a Woman is double Meet Joe Black (85% vs 42%) so it is general conscious I think I'm even ranking "Gigli" higher than Meet Joe Black. Just because the awfulness of "Gigli" is more interesting to me. It's weird to have the three guys being so in unison for "Meet Joe Black" being good when it seems to be a rare opinion
> It's weird to have the three guys being so in unison for "Meet Joe Black" being good when it seems to be a rare opinion Try looking up literally any audience aggregate score for Meet Joe Black
That is so wild to me lol. Scent of a Woman was absolutely ridiculous to me and I was locked in for Joe Black the whole time. Great acting, great score, a touch of fantasy. Solid stuff!
I appreciate hearing that. *Scent* IS ridiculous. *Meet Joe Black* does have a consistency of tone.... I said to someone if you removed the dialogue track you would definitely think *MJB* was at least as good or better. It's "accomplished" and very committed to its whatever, insane premise and themes. But..... *Scent* locks together like a dumb Oscarbait-y Lego castle.
Two great 90s scores, as well. Always a sucker for those.
Consistency of tone?? That's a wild opinion IMO. The shifts between born yesterday almost slapstick surrealism comedy and "heartfelt" drama - the impossible task for Forlani to play a real person who also falls in love (or is simply horny for) cooky-insane-doll-boy-baby-devil-Pitt is just one of the most jarring juxtapositions I've seen.
I still think it's true, though. The look of the movie, production design.... what the music is doing in every scene, insistently nudging you to this wistful place in which nullities (every character is a nullity) can attest their love for each other over and over again. Sure, a few confrontations here and there. This is not a good movie, but it all feels like it's directed by the same person.
Add this to list of insane takes that the both of them somehow share. Sometimes I wish they’d disagree more just so I could hear someone push back a bit instead of acting like this is a common opinion.
I viscerally dislike this movie in ways I can’t fully articulate. I just find it so self indulgent with nothing actually interesting to say about life, love, etc. It’s probably in my bottom five of movies they’ve covered, definitely bottom ten, alongside Pinocchio, The Last Airbender, a few of the Burtons, and Space Jam: A New Legacy. I’d rewatch Rollerall five times before I’d watch Meet Joe Black again.
In a Covid daze I marathoned Scent of a Woman, Meet Joe Black and Gigli. I'd watch Gigli again before this one.
The guys being into this is maybe the prime example of Blank Check Brain. Watching a director's entire filmography and discussing it for dozens of hours leads you to think there's something interesting in a disaster like this when in fact, it is a turd. (still liked the episode)
I do kinda like that though. You can watch a movie like this in its context as a pretty bad 1998 film (which most other critics or podcasts would do) or in its context as a Martin Brest film (which is obviously what BC does). And so sure, you sometimes don't get the wider context of what people at the time thought but it makes for an interesting episode for discussion.
The thing that got me was how many lengthy pauses were splattered all over every dialogue scene like everyone's constantly saying the most profound thing on earth but it's mostly shit like "his name............................. is Joe" and "I do................................ like peanut butter"
Not only are there pauses, everyone constantly repeats what's just been said to them.
You'd finish Rollerball five times faster too
It's truly the most nothing of a film I maybe have ever watched.
Lotta Succession parallels in this one! Quince makes for a great Tom Wambsgams.
I’ve never thought Hopkins was supposed to be American in this, didn’t detect even an attempt at an accent. Does it say he’s American at any point? Great episode, good to have RiLaws back. I also like the movie!
Mustardayonnaise mentioned 😄🙌🏾🥪
In the same week that Jay pleads guilty! Granted it was recorded a while ago.
I have thought about that every time I have made a sandwich for 20 years
"Goodbye, daddy. I'm dying."
Shoutout to the BC production crew for picking up Griff's clean flick of the comedy points coin to Richard for his Nixon joke. Incredibly satisfying
This really did a number on my zoomer brain. Took me 5 hours to finish. I actually don’t mind the premise. Beings of a higher power coming to grips with the simple reality they’re responsible for is always a soft spot for me, so I really wanted to like this movie, I just felt like everything was moving at .25x speed. That plus the ending threw about 300 questions at me that will never be solved. Still think it’s higher than Scent of a Woman because it’s trying something even if it’s at a glaciers pace.
I’m not a zoomer and def did something to my brain. It’s so fucking slow.
Nah don't blame this on a generational thing, every generation can hate this film and find it boring as hell together.
I had to take two separate breaks to get through this one
This was the first movie I saw in theaters that made me realize some movies are too fucking long
First time ever seeing Meet Joe Black was a couple weeks ago and I went in cold not knowing anything except the one thing - I've spent more than 11 minutes on the internet so I was very aware that he gets ragdolled by two cars. I was not aware that that happens in like the first ten minutes. For some reason I always just assumed that's how the movie ended so it still came as a surprise to see it that early. Also the introduction scene at dinner where Marcia Gay Harden and Jeffrey Tambor are like "YOU GOTTA NAME, SON????" "SPIT IT OUT ALREADY!!!" "JOE? JUST JOE? THAT'S IT?????" is insane. Nobody would behave like that. Not since the old woman at the end of The Last Jedi have we seen movie characters so rudely inquisitive about someone's name. Didn't love the movie. Sorry.
Wasn’t it rise of Skywalker? I only saw that one once so I could be wrong
It was, you’re right
I haven't seen The Waterboy in at least 20 years, but I feel confident in slightly correcting Griffin: Bobby Boucher is not a kicker, he's a linebacker. He needs to visualize people being mean to him in order to unlock his rage so he can tackle real good, not kick the football hard.
Is this the episode that will have the most Blankies disagreeing with it? Usually when the two friends advocate for a movie most people think is bad, the sub takes on tone that's like "well, it's common knowledge this is actually a good movie, they said so on a podcast", but I think even the Blankies are unwilling to meet Joe Blank.
Listening to the episode it sounds like they barely agree with themselves about their opinion
Right? They talk about the soundtrack being great but then how it overwhelms things, they mention the pacing is bad, that a lot of it is fully insane in ways that undercut the material around it… they have very few positive things to say about the movie besides the performances.
Ironically, I felt that way particularly about these three doing Benjamin Button. At two different points in the podcast, they praise Pitt's character for two completely contradictory things, and also that the movie "stayed honest to the diary format", despite showing parts of his life in vivid detail he wouldn't have remembered or wrote down.
I heavily disagreed with the 3 of them about Benjamin Button and did not understand at all their defense of that film, but honestly, I *kinda* see where their more understanding, milder defense of MJB is coming from, even if I found it to be boring to the point of unwatchable. There are aspects to this film that are almost compelling, but it's obvious flaws really ruin it for most people. I also think it's a case of interesting premise, horrible execution.
That and the Green Mile hate.
Actually I recently rewatched The Green Mile for the first time in maybe 15 years and was shocked by how much it stinks. There's a handful of good moments though.
As someone who disagrees with probably half of their takes, this is definitely on the more indefensible side!
Did people disagree with their (primarily) positive take on Welcome to Marwen? It didn't help that episode was David, Ben, and Marie drunkenly yelling at Griffin into submission, but this sounds more controlled. I think Marwen is a dogshit film.
So sounds like we're gonna need Ben to show up and provide the perspective that this movie is pure butt.
Yeah the “Chris O’Donnell Fan Club” folks who downvoted me before the Scent ep dropped for a mild take about him being dull got surprisingly quiet after the ep dropped with Krumholtz positively murdering him.
Jake Weber was the only one sorta acting rationally to his boss, who earlier admitted to hearing things, bringing in this total stranger and giving him unlimited access to the company and family
One of the signs of the badness of this movie is that at least 50% of what the "villain" does is actually perfectly defensible and normal behavior. Death and taxes.....
Philip Roth Adaptations patreon miniseries NOW!
Podcast’s Complaint
Lawson's suggestion of The Pod Against Americast was also great
I was surprised there was no mention of the somewhat problematic twist ending of The Human Stain
Justice for Richard - “1B, 2B, 3B”.. “PB” deserved so many comedy points
one time i fell asleep to legends of the fall on cable and when i woke up meet joe black (also pitt & hopkins) was on. i had never seen meet joe black and i thought legends took a very insane tonal turn that i didn’t remember. especially waking up from one of those killer naps, was one of the most surreal movie watching memories i have
That reminds me of when I was a kid I fell asleep watching Lynch's *Dune* and when I woke up someone had switched the channel to *Tremors*. For a very long time I thought *Dune* ended with a bunch of local rednecks blowing up the Shai-Hulud with dynamite.
Honestly I love the guys but sometimes they get a little too swayed by the fact that a big swing was taken
I think that just happens when you watch (too) many movies. You laud movies for doing something different.
Yes
Ben playing the part of Death throughout this was so low-key but hilarious. Really felt like a classic Blank Check runner (like him playing Benbot in the *A.I. Artificial Intelligence* episode). Also loved the effect on Griffin's voice when he started talking about Hopkins' hearing the voice in his head.
The thing i remember most about this movie is the Best Dramatic Pause bit during the mtv movie awards
[Ha ha!](https://youtu.be/9LdqUmUyxHI?si=cXyfNSMETrWZxype&t=883)
Hated the movie and was expecting to not enjoy this episode knowing they all liked it...but this was a great episode! I laughed more than I can recall on any recent listen and it feels like they stayed on topic the whole time.
Re: Discworld Death's books were always my favorite. I've never heard of the movie Death Takes a Holiday they reference, but the plot sounds very much like Reaper Man, where Death goes on holiday as a farmer and then people stop dying. It's from 1991, so I guess riffing on that movie was just in the air at the time?
There’s a Sandman version too, where she’s human for a day
Blankie and Discworld nerd checking in
Living Out Loud is good
When starting the episode: "damn I was hoping for a longer episode!" After hearing their initial take: "thank GOD this isn't a longer episode!" J/k and all that, you like what you like and I love people who love movies, but how this can't be immediately classified as the worst film they've ever covered is beyond me. This one I truly rancid IMO.
It's quite bad. I kind of get what they're saying, the score completes its mission of getting the viewer into a crying state. The problem is, all of the characters have brain damage.
I said on another thread that this would be better with a comedic actor as Joe Black (Jim Carrey, Robin Williams), but now I'm realizing that's just BEING THERE: A fish out of water who knows nothing of this world taken in by the family of a dying rich old man played by a legend and changes everyone's lives and disappears at the end. And like Griffin says at the top of ep, for any other actor the Hopkins performance could be career-best work...Melvyn Douglas won an Oscar for the old guy in BEING THERE! (maybe they bring up Being There, I'm only 10 mins in)
I think I heard Griffin briefly mention it. But Being There is 100% what I was thinking while watching it last night. Probably because Being There is so fresh to me and I also LOVED it.
Being There knows exactly what kind of movie it is. This one has no idea so tries to be like 4 different things at once.
In addition to what others here added, the *Being There* DNA is very weak, the movie pursues that thread only very intermittently. The *Being There* note is very specific; it's a normal question or situation responded to with maximum vagueness and then the rest of the room going "Oh! Yes indeed! I never thought of it that way! Good man!" etc. This does happen a couple times but it's more just like screenwriterly indecision than any actual theme.
I dunno, they mention Patch Adams doing this sort of thing the very same year, so, not so sure about Robin.
**M E E T J O E** *black*
“Water _man_, father!”
I wouldn't say the movie is good, but there's a great movie in here trying to get out. I think some masterful editing could have made this a banger 2-hour flick. I think some screenwriting changes could have made this a classic.
In the first 5 minutes of the episode, they speculate that Anthony Hopkins didn't put on the werewolf makeup for The Wolfman, but according to Rick Baker, Hopkins relished that stuff. I doubt it's him doing the wirework, but he's in the makeup otherwise. As Baker tells it, they had a pretty miserable time on the movie because no one cared about the makeup effects and the studio/producers (and even Joe Johnston) were trying to do everything with CGI. The only people who cared and made the job worth it were Benicio Del Toro and Anthony Hopkins. They also had to reshoot the ending and Hopkins had lost 70 lbs, but this made the makeup even better according to this clip: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJGTY4M18lI](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJGTY4M18lI)
Lol this movie is bad
David killed me with the line about that weird 'ageless' billionaire "looking like went through the car wash"
Is British Netflix spelled with a u?
I, uh, liked it quite a bit lol. I don’t know why but I had a great time with it. It’s probably my second favorite Brest and I don’t see Gigli changing that lol.
This is bonkers to me, but I love seeing how different everyone's opinions are.
I also really enjoyed MJB way more than I was expecting. I think it's the combination of Hopkins and the incredible set design - it's so expensive looking and I really enjoyed just spending time in that world. Marcia Gay Harden is doing her best Parker Posey and Claire Forlani is styled so specifically '90's that I lost my elder millennial mind. (Her lipstick! Chinos and gray T-shirt - may as well play a GAP swing dance commercial!) I thought Brad was bad when he was playing blank. He worked in scenes where some of his personality showed though - I didn't like the business plot but the IRS scene was hilarious because he was a character.
Wait lol which of his three great movies are you ceding it to?
His best movie IS Going in Style
Anthony Hopkins is my grandmother’s cousin (or was, she has sadly passed away last year). I have never met him - I am not sure that *she* ever met him, honestly - but I have always jokingly called him “Uncle Anthony”. So hearing Richard Lawson do an impression of “Uncle Anthony” signing a fan letter was a trip!
Sorry if this is super random, but every time the main theme played in this movie I was getting V for Vendetta vibes (where V emerges from the fire in the flashback). I know they're different composers, but did anyone hear something similar?
Thank you! The similarity was bugging me and I couldn't place it.
Thanks for the validation!
Isn’t 90s Depp the answer? Edward Scissorhands similarly a baby man
“his cum is full of skulls” is an all-timer line
Thurgood Stubbs: 'Phantom Menace is the best Star Wars yet!'
The only thing I knew about this movie was Brad Pitt doing Jamaican patois. Unfortunately this isn’t the worst Jamaican accent I’ve heard lol
Ben was really channeling Bandit in “Born Yesterday.” Parent hive rise up!!
I’m guessing Griff knows so little about sports, despite being in a football movie, that he thinks the point of football is to kick the ball hard. Of course in the Waterboy he uses his anger to tackle with great force. Though at a point his teammate does use the same logic to kick the ball.
Another thing about The Waterboy: It really feels like the heir to Sandler’s SNL work, as so many of his characters were [something] Boy/Man. Opera Man, Canteen Boy, the Herlihy Boy.
When they were going through other actors who could've been an alternative to Pitt I thought they would mention Depp. Joe has a bit of a Scissorhands vibe to me but Keanu definitely has the blankness that might've worked more.
Thomas Newman absolutely cooked with this movie's score
Scent of a Woman & Gigli > Meet Joe Black Would rather watch an insane person ramble than paint dry David & Griffin might as well do a Ron Howard run now, each milquetoast movie will get a 5/5
Gigli > Scent of a Woman > Meet Joe Black
Team Sanity
I started Gigli yesterday and kinda liked it until I hit the roadblock that is Justin Bartha’s character and had to stop. I’ll power through and finish, but woof.
I like this movie! The core of this movie that interests me more than Scent of a woman or Gigli is that it’s an original feeling premise with a take, I honestly could not see just anyone making this movie but Brest comes in having this fully formed take on life and death and it comes through perfectly. I will admit that it has issues, the main one being an issue all post Midnight Run movies Brest make in which he has a subplot that could be entirely cut and the resolution of the subplot it often forgets is hollow and overly convenient. I really don’t see anything in the movie that makes Pitt knowing how to act like an IRS agent make sense. In the same vein I don’t get why Al Pacino has anything to say that’s helpful or effective in that school room courthouse scene in Scent of a Woman.
Joe Black recasting: Matt Damon?
Maybe for a more ambiguous “am I supposed to like him or not” movie. Mid-90s Damon was firmly in that mode with Ripley and parts of Good Will Hunting, and an outright dick in School Ties.
So pleased they liked the movie and didn’t dunk on it (I mean, this film is eminently dunkable). It’s such a warm bath of a film. I love it
I do not want to hand it to Jeffrey Tambor, given his personal shit, but I really think his Quincy performance is the most compelling part of the film. He’s the only one matching Hopkins’ acting prowess in this.
Yeah, Tambor is unfortunately really great here. Since seeing the movie a few weeks back, I often think of how he plays both the board vote scene when he realizes what he's complicit in and the scene with Pitt where he reveals how deeply he cares about Hopkins and Marcia Gay Harden. He does the heartbroken vulnerability really beautifully.
The green mile is shitty? Hoo boy, that’s certainly a take
It's a take that David has thrown out before, so I at least respect the commitment to the consistency. Doesn't mean it's technically true, just from a ratings perspective, or at that it's Oscar Nomination is considered unjustified, but you like what you like, and dislike what you dislike.
Re: The Pitt/Jeffrey Tambor dummy convo That's why the budget on F1(The Kosinski movie) is so big. They keep having to send the Tambor dummies back because they're not up to Pitt's standard!
First episode in a while where the movie is longer than the episode?
For whatever reason, always loved this movie. Glad that it received “the royal treatment”
I like Seven Years in Tibet a lot more than this, even if every time Pitt says "heem-a-LYE-as" I die a little from laughter.
Chris Evans: “It’s like he’s addicted to shit” 😂😂
The fact that they are confused by Claire Forlani’s career going down without mentioning her issues with Harvey Weinstein is unacceptable
Is Death only there for humans or all beings? Cause that’s a lot. Is there a version where Death takes over an ant body