In threads with the "Feedback (@Blizzard) | Suggestion | Idea" Flair, constructive feedback, suggestions for adjusting and improving existing systems and mechanics etc can be given, but also your own ideas, mockups / illustrations (e.g. for new systems, mechanics, items, etc) can be shared with the community.
**This Flair is not for asking for feedback for your build**. For that, use one of the Class-specific Flairs, or the "Builds, Skills & Items" Flair.
Please also remember that 1) submissions made with the "Feedback (@Blizzard) | Suggestion | Idea" have to be constructive, civil and adequately elaborate, and that 2) we are a fan subreddit and not officially Blizzard, so we can not 100% guarantee that your feedback will be noticed, even though the devs / CM's mentioned they regularly read reddit, twitter, and other places for feedback. This flair can simply help to find potential feedback more easily.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/diablo4) if you have any questions or concerns.*
All party members should be asked to put in their own Runeshards, and receive 100% rewards upon completion. If they choose not to participate, they can select Decline and stay out of the pit while the rest of the group runs it.
The problem was solved years ago in D3 with Greater Rifts.
Honestly, without looking it up I'm just like 90% sure they come from NMDs but because I had to run so many of those for my glyphs I have more fragments than I'll ever need.
They come from helltide chests, nmd, and whisper caches. And Iron Wolves rep also drops a bunch over time.
So yeah, people racking a ton doing NMD leveling glypys, then a few from whispers and iron wolves, then a ton more from Hell Tide
Diablo IV in a nutshell. “If everything is special then nothing is.” They have no idea how to focus a player’s attention by emphasizing the good things while simultaneously removing tedious friction.
The worst part is that they already figured so much of this out for Diablo 3. It's like they went "people didn't like D3 when it launched so let's completely ignore it while designing D4!" They either consciously didn't learn any lessons _or_ they didn't even think to look at what D3 did right. Either way, no a good look on them, even now that the game has gotten much better.
It's more that they fire literally everybody after games are complete now, or transfer new games to entirely new subsections of the company, and so every new game starts from scratch even though it doesn't have to. This is basically what happened to a few of the Borderlands games as well: why does the Pre-Sequel have big empty open areas that are boring and just waste time like Borderlands 1? Because it was made by totally different people on a totally different continent and nobody shared notes, lol.
But that doesn't explain anything. Even if the entire team was new and none of the people high enough up on the chain had anything to do with any other Diablo game, their assignment was still to build a new Diablo game. One of the first steps should be to look at what was done before and which parts of it they should keep.
I make software for a living too, and I've made new versions of older software that was made by other companies too. I _always_ base my work off of what was there before and only make changes to existing features if I have a good reason to (i.e. different specifications from the client, new features that clash with old ones, or I simply have a better idea...which I'll run by the client first anyway). It's really not that difficult to do, but it does require someone in charge who respects the client's and/or users' time.
Sitting on 3000 and I have all my stuff 12/12 plus another spec of stuff 12/12 plus any Uber sitting in my stash is 12/12…like yeah silly I can’t group with friends or they get less
I love D4 but admit it's super frustrating to see the team not taking D3 lessons. Armory, summon mtls per group member (though I guess even D3 Uber bosses worked the same as D4), changing up abilities with the different runes, etc.
Yeah. The skill runes from D3 was a nice way to change skills even further. I hope they had something similar down the road. Adding fire damage to Tornado, or changing Blizzard to Lightning. Whatever it may be, just new ways to customize our builds for different synergies.
I swear I must have played a different version of D3 then the people on this sub. D3's rune system was literally a matter of which color of this skill gives me the highest damage output and you went with that every time. There was no choice involved. I really don't understand why some people seemed to like it so much.
It was. Certain runes were basically straight up downgrades compared to their counterparts. They were technically usable for easier content thanks to the insane scaling but that's basically what's happening now in d4 with certain poorly supported skills. Could you clear pit 61 with them? Probably yes. There's just no reason to do so outside of some kind of irrational attachment to the skill because there are plainly better alternatives.
I don't think that's necessarily true. There were tons of setups you could do depending on the rest of your gear and preference / playstyle. Even looking at the leaderboards and you'd see a half dozen or more setups for each of the builds.
I agree the current skilltree is kinda boring but I really hope they're not going the D3 route or else we'll be back to playing predefined builds again just like with D3's sets :(
it's already the case. With the iron wolf rep you receive a predefined build through aspects. Each class has one specific build. And sets will come with the new extension. This game is going to be d3 enhanced very soon
I think what really irks me is that they will *eventually* do just this, and be all smiles and pat themselves on the back during campfire chats, joking “we heard you and we did this, hurhurhur” when it shouldnt have even been an issue in the first place. Im getting so tired of reading “this is a problem that has been solved” because its become
par for the fucking course with this team.
They dont know how to innovate because they lack a clear fundamental understanding of whats come before.
The cost to open the rift should be zero. If I have to do an activity a stupid amount of times for the material required to upgrade my junk, the cost for that activity should be zero and everyone who goes in should get the same amount from the reward pool for doing the activity.
The currency is not needed at all and is wasted programming. Same with reward throttling for people who didn't open the rift. Imagine going in with a full squad and having to rotate taking turns just to make it fair and then understanding the sheer volume of runs that will need to be made for a group of 4 because 3 out of 4 runs will be half progress on a material that escalates in amount needed.
I mean as it sits right now, it *is* effectively zero to open for the most part. I'm currently sitting on 7,279 Runeshards. I could run the Pit 2,426 times in a row before running out. So I'm not entirely sure the purpose behind the Runeshards. I would think either making it free to open *or* leaning into the opposite direction and making them harder to obtain.
One option they could do, is making it so Runeshards only drop from one or two sources, like NMD's and World Bosses. However, this would limit the amount of Pit runs people do, and because of that I would think there would need to be a boost to the Pit materials gained at the end. You have to run a lot of Pits to Masterwork your gear as it stands already with them being practically free. I believe it was 130 Pit runs at Tier 101 to 100% Masterwork all your gear (without resets).
That it's tied to masterworking means you can't make it expensive (time or resources) to open. It's why I say just remove the cost completely or reduce the amount of times I need to do it to masterwork my crap.
Why?? So that a party of friends can participate in the Pit together and receive the same rewards. Currently, everyone else besides the person that opens the Pit receives 1/2 the amount of materials at the end. It encourages people to disband their parties and run the pit solo for maximum benefit, instead of friends playing together.
I'm not sure I'm following what you're getting at. That's what I would like is for everyone to receive 100% of the materials they would normally earn whether it's solo, or in a party.
Currently in a party of 4, one member pays 3 Runeshards to open the pit. The other three members in the party do not have to pay anything. All four members run the pit together, and at the end of the Pit the person that paid the Runeshards gets 100% of Masterworking Materials that they would normally earn, while the other members receive 50% of the materials they would normally earn. Effectively reducing the amount of materials they are earning for doing the same content they could have run solo.
This is why I do pit solo or I carry friends who aren't as geared as I am. Being disincentivized from running pits with people is a real bummer and I hope blizzard fixes it
It really sucks. Esspecially for my gf and I who couch coop and she doesn't farm like I do. Everytime something comes out it's met with WHAT ABOUT THE SOLO. As if they have to only play solo or its hard to msg in 1 of 3 forums LFG "boss".
Yeah it's pretty stupid because I played with a barb last night and we were fucking cruising through 101's at like 3 minutes. Pretty good synergy. This guy had the best gear I've ever seen to I don't know why he paid me I think it was just because he wanted to feel it out
I open the pit and I see him come in with me and this is the first time that's ever happened and I'm on controller trying to type out and freaking out out out finally everything dies and I look at his gear and I'm like Jesus Christ what the fuck
3GA doombringer GA grandfather 4GA pain gorgers shaco tyrell's...
Hardcore by the way
Was fun though
Yeah this was on hardcore so I'm thinking maybe he bought the account itself I don't know. Possible I did that shit like 20 years ago in dark age Camelot and then a couple other games I think. Wow
Duuude, you can rake in $100M per hour?? I wish I knew how to do that. I had just crossed the $100M threshold on my lvl 100 druid after like 14 hours of playtime. Worth noting I never grinded for gold, but I also never spent a lot of gold on affix swaps or masterworking. $1B felt completely out of reach until I actually started listing items on the trading website.
I tend to combine selling items and boosting people on the pit, haven't done it in a while since I hit gold cap a couple times before the pit nerf but I was pulling way over 100M per hour
They shouldn't get more crafting mats from it for grouping. Group players should all have to put in their shards to join the Pit, and then just get the standard 100% of rewards, given they've put the same in to start it.
No one's asking to get more mats for grouping. They're asking to get the same mats for grouping. The party members that didn't open the instance get half the mats.
Yes boss mats only drop for the person who put the summon mats in or, in this case, the Pit mats. That's how all boss mats work.
Although in the case of Pits since stones aren't a guaranteed drop, I do kinda think they should change that.
No it’s isn’t correct. eg whoever opened pears to get twice as much as the other. This is anecdotal but I could supply screen shots if I could be arsed 😂
In the end it should be about choice and preference.
Solo, group, changing it up. Everyone pays the same cost if there is one, if something costs 5 something then a group of 3 pays 15 total, and a solo player pays 5 and so on.
That way you can play in whatever composition you like and it is fair to everyone. Nobody should get any extra exp, loot or whatever, not outside of increased efficiency. You should play in a group because you want to, not because it is best - same with solo play.
The real reason is they don't want grouping to be that much better than solo play. For a long ass time in D3 grouping was realistically the best way to play whether it be GRs, bounties, farming keys in normal rifts, or just leveling at the start of the season
The disparity between solo play and group play was a problem they were looking to solve because if you were serious about pushing the ladder in D3 you *had* to group(bots aside)
I played WoW for a long time and stopped playing it because they made the game a chore by grinding daily’s and putting so much behind group quest (Mythic Dungeons, some raid quest etc.) I work third shift and play super late at night so I enjoy being a he to do everything solo. I do group a lot with my clan members but it have to be online earlier than normal to do it.
And yet they've made a game along the lines of an MMO, completely online, but people can't play in groups because they'll be penalized.
That's got to be one of the top 10 decisions made at Blizzard.
D2 also had benefits playing with friends, the MF/rune drop rate went higher and increased exp gains. It's odd to me they are actively discouraging grouping.
Don’t give that “you know what D4 was when you bought it” bullshit.
D4 is a completely different game now than since launch, and it’s the loud members of the community that have dictated the changes.
I like killing the mobs at my own pace. I've played every Diablo game and have grouped maybe 30 times with friends.
I'm fine with people getting more mats or xp from grouping because they have to deal with the headache. Playing "who gets to the mob first" is boring af.
If people want to be antisocial that’s their problem. The devs shouldn’t be catering to gremlins that burn in sunlight. They should be catering to fun happy people that want to group up who are going to draw more people to the game. If they need an activity for miserable solo people fine have one but it should not give out vital materials needed for endgame. If those antisocial players want the good stuff they can do like they have to in every other game and learn to cooperate. This should not be the game for the kids that didn’t know how to play at school, it should be the game for the kids that did.
I feel like you didn't play d3 to a high level if you have these opinions
Think of it the other way for a second. If you can push higher pit levels with more people by nature of how the game works, you'd feel almost pushed into it.
Look at Uber boss runs. If you have a set, you run it, you get 1 boss kill. If you find 3 other people who each have a set and now you've 4x your materials effectively cutting down the time to run bosses by 4. Looking at it that way, playing solo seems like a pretty stupid idea no?
They dont *want* to force people into group play. Like I said they're trying to solve the disparity between the two styles
I stopped playing D3 before RoS came out because the last stage of my professional training started and I didn’t have the time or inclination to laser things down for hours with disintegrate, sell for gold, buy another 10 DPS from the AH and keep going. I don’t really recognise D3 as an example of good anything to be honest - I’m not familiar with any of the endgame systems they eventually implemented, the game looked like rainbow vomit, all I know is it had infinite scaling and lots of colours and everything was free.
I am unashamedly in favour of pushing people to play together. They won’t do it by themselves. I want to feel forced to group up and I want everyone else to feel forced to group up too. If they got on comms they might actually have some fun, win or lose. I came to D4 from Destiny 2 and greatly enjoyed being good enough at that game to carry and teach other players, being needed by other players and needing them to perform too. I want co-op Diablo, not solo Diablo, and that means I need the game designed to force people to play together. It’s like pulling teeth getting people to do anything more than like a 2x rotation off comms right now. Everybody has to feed the kids, talk to the spouse, water the swingset, mow the pool, have their third nap of the day, play something else, etc etc etc. I want people playing Diablo 4 together lol. Will say it loudly and proudly. Does not bother me one bit. If the game suddenly couldn’t be played without a ride or die team of 4 that would suit me just fine.
As they said in campfire chat "since solo players felt inefficient running bosses like duriel without the group, we felt like making an activity where it wouldn't be beneficial to run in a party, even if you could"
I mean, I guess, but common blizz, there are better ways.
Or...
Fix that problem rather than create new ones.
Make every activity require mats from every participant. Instant equality.
Edit... Or, to allow friends to play together even if they don't have mats... let a player join without mats for free for a token reward, or pay mats to gain full rewards. Like the maiden, but a bit more extreme.
Not very different than softcore. Carries vary from 30M to 50M per run and some average 2 minutes per clear. Can do around 20 runs per hour maybe 25 in some crazy case where players rarely go sell/salvage and just pick up mats and GA.
Should be more in hardcore IMO.
I really don't see why group play in the Pit should be disincentivized. When you are pushing you don't really care about the rewards anyways, for speed runs it hardly matters and the materials to enter the Pit should just be removed completely. They could add the condition that every player in the group has to unlock tier levels themselves, so you cannot get carried by others to farm mats.
How is it, that I see these posts daily now and all of them up voted, while I made the exact same post (without stygian knowledge), and I got down voted to hell and laughed at from every single comment, that "everyone knows it because it's daily posted"?
Typical reddit behavior 😂
They should just make it like D3 was with GR keys, if you're in a group and accept starting a pit it uses everyones runeshards, just like everyone who wanted to participate in the gr had to have keys.
And everyone should get full mats and equal chances of stones. Spend the runesgards, get the loots, simple.
The idea was to avoid the thing people have with uber roations, where the "correct" way to play is to do it with multiple people rotating who pays to get more tries for less resources.
But they're not rare, so it doesn't matter at all, and ultimately, if they really cared, they would've just made everyone require keys. It's a half assed solution to a nonexistent problem.
I would actually play D4 if I could skip the open world, Helltides, and nightmare dungeons and just level entirely though The Pit like we can in D3.
I’ll die on the hill that D3 right now is still a better game than D4 tbh 🤷♂️
For real man! When my mates and I do pits it feels so awkward that all 4 of us have to go into pits solo just so we get the same amount instead of going all in together and have some shits and giggles
Im just gonna throw it out here, i love the idea that we have like a good handful of different content
I dont like the idea of having a dozen+n types of summoning mats. My first few afternoons in WT4 was literally just googling what is what lol
Don't need the bonus to incentivize grouping, just make everyone get the same amount of materials.
You should not be punished for playing with friends.
Isn't there a stacking debuff that kills you on certain non pit bosses too? I played multiplayer once and playing those same bosses sucked compared to solving them. Felt punished when playing multiplayer.
Why? Because of people giving absolute trash opinions like [this one](https://www.reddit.com/r/diablo4/comments/1cionbv/diablo_iv_patch_notes_season_4/l2akxky/) and Blizzard listening to them.
I wasn't aware someone was taking advantage of me, only they wanted to open the pit and wouldn't enter if I initiated it.
Only figured out after a few rounds I was getting half the amount I usually get.
It's a real put off, I have no idea why anyone would want to do pits in groups. I only do it solo now.
Pits are probably the thing you spend the most time doing though. It's dumb to have that thing be the one that you can really only do solo. My group wouldn't mind the inefficiency of the hp scaling, that would be worth it to have fun together, but not having styg drop, and only getting half of mats is ridiculous.
I few things i hope they change with pit
1. Everyone put their mats and everyone get equal mats.
2. Simpler maps with least diverted path
3. Spawn near where we die, not in a couple
Of block away.
4. Potions drop faster.
5. Certain tedious maps should be removed.
Heya just a recent tip I found out to kinda help with #3 in boss room - if you teleport to the guardian chamber and walk slightly backwards to "unfog" that section of the map, when you die you will respawn in the guardian chamber instead of being thrown back 100 rooms.
So many posts on here saying why doesn't bliz make this easier, why don't they just remove required mats. The game is ridiculously easy already to a point where it's almost brain dead boring. Make it harder. Make people grind and farm mats for END GAME. Non of this spoon fed retard shit.
The game has only got easier and easier since launch. The new expansion will probably make it an idle auto clicker game.
Do literally nothing and Shacos rain from the sky.
It's better to get more drops per boss summon because summon mats are incredibly tedious to farm.
And whether you're solo or in a group, the boss dies in 2 seconds anyway.
It’s deliberate. They don’t want us grouping up to do things faster or have more fun. They want us kinda miserable, kinda stuck in a loop, suffering alone, hoping the general grind will change our fortunes (spoiler: it doesn’t, only grinding the Pit for hours and hours does that). If they let us play the way we want, they can’t control the taps and levers that make us spend more or less time in the game, giving them better metrics and chances of cosmetic sales. We are here to be slaves to Blizzard and feel like we’re having fun while we do it. Nothing else. Group Pit is fun, sharing the burden of all that farming feels good, therefore it must be disincentivised as it would give players options and agency. Those are bad things for Blizzard. People need to understand, they want us to be unsatisfied, the same way a food manufacturer puts ALMOST enough sugar into their food so you keep eating it. It’s just the way it is. Should they change it? Absolutely. Will they? I doubt it. They’ve been penalising group play from launch.
More people play the game solo than grouped because they are punished for grouping instead of incentivised. People ran NMDs together before they made it a 100% monster health increase for every additional person. When it was only an 80% increase there was an incentive to group up and people did. An incentive that by the way had ZERO impact on someone who wanted to play alone.
The best features since launch? Always involve other people. Everyone loved the ‘blood tides’, said it was great to see more people around, they loved the event. Look at the ‘tech farm’ from last season, again, everyone loved playing together and complimented the ease of joining in the fun + getting progression at the same time. Same with being able to level in Helltide now and Blood Maiden. The Vault was complimented for packing vendors and players together and actually feeling like a gathering place, so they made all towns like that.
They only DISINCENTIVISE group play when they want to control how long your grind is and how good your odds are of ever getting your character to where you want. Otherwise they’re happy to make collaborative play part of the game and they always get praise for doing it.
Solo pits requires 3 runeshard, if a party of 4 enters, each one pays 1 runeshard and they get extra rewards for giving an extra runeshard, makes it even more rewarding doing group pits and of course the mobs and the boss should scale by the number of party members.
D4 is not d3 ….Stop it!!!!
Not the same devs and not the same game.
It’s like saying why does d4 not learn from titan quest or grim dawn.
They are different gamessssssss…….
It's all playtime and bs metrics like that. They want each individual player to have to run the pit as the leader to have a shot at a stone. It's very anti player. Something Blizz has been fluent in lately.
This is the correct answer, those have been rampant since Duriel’s release.(The anger is understandable to a degree, but as it is a live service game, group play will likely be favored in the end)
But it shouldn’t be a surprise they’ve reacted this way
Oh, okay, sorry. I'm sure ppl won't lie about anything to keep the mob at bay, so you're probably right to assume they would never lie to us about Anything.
Yep but this is who the devs are developing for. The bitter edgy kids who can’t make any friends and want their happy chemicals NOW with no one else involved.
In threads with the "Feedback (@Blizzard) | Suggestion | Idea" Flair, constructive feedback, suggestions for adjusting and improving existing systems and mechanics etc can be given, but also your own ideas, mockups / illustrations (e.g. for new systems, mechanics, items, etc) can be shared with the community. **This Flair is not for asking for feedback for your build**. For that, use one of the Class-specific Flairs, or the "Builds, Skills & Items" Flair. Please also remember that 1) submissions made with the "Feedback (@Blizzard) | Suggestion | Idea" have to be constructive, civil and adequately elaborate, and that 2) we are a fan subreddit and not officially Blizzard, so we can not 100% guarantee that your feedback will be noticed, even though the devs / CM's mentioned they regularly read reddit, twitter, and other places for feedback. This flair can simply help to find potential feedback more easily. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/diablo4) if you have any questions or concerns.*
All party members should be asked to put in their own Runeshards, and receive 100% rewards upon completion. If they choose not to participate, they can select Decline and stay out of the pit while the rest of the group runs it. The problem was solved years ago in D3 with Greater Rifts.
The mats to open the portal are so abundant they might as well not exist. They should just remove them altogether.
I’m over here thinking, I don’t even know where the mats even drop. I just know I have a lot.
Honestly, without looking it up I'm just like 90% sure they come from NMDs but because I had to run so many of those for my glyphs I have more fragments than I'll ever need.
They come from helltide chests, nmd, and whisper caches. And Iron Wolves rep also drops a bunch over time. So yeah, people racking a ton doing NMD leveling glypys, then a few from whispers and iron wolves, then a ton more from Hell Tide
That’s what I thought, come out of the chest at the end.
Diablo IV in a nutshell. “If everything is special then nothing is.” They have no idea how to focus a player’s attention by emphasizing the good things while simultaneously removing tedious friction.
The worst part is that they already figured so much of this out for Diablo 3. It's like they went "people didn't like D3 when it launched so let's completely ignore it while designing D4!" They either consciously didn't learn any lessons _or_ they didn't even think to look at what D3 did right. Either way, no a good look on them, even now that the game has gotten much better.
It's more that they fire literally everybody after games are complete now, or transfer new games to entirely new subsections of the company, and so every new game starts from scratch even though it doesn't have to. This is basically what happened to a few of the Borderlands games as well: why does the Pre-Sequel have big empty open areas that are boring and just waste time like Borderlands 1? Because it was made by totally different people on a totally different continent and nobody shared notes, lol.
But that doesn't explain anything. Even if the entire team was new and none of the people high enough up on the chain had anything to do with any other Diablo game, their assignment was still to build a new Diablo game. One of the first steps should be to look at what was done before and which parts of it they should keep. I make software for a living too, and I've made new versions of older software that was made by other companies too. I _always_ base my work off of what was there before and only make changes to existing features if I have a good reason to (i.e. different specifications from the client, new features that clash with old ones, or I simply have a better idea...which I'll run by the client first anyway). It's really not that difficult to do, but it does require someone in charge who respects the client's and/or users' time.
Sitting on 3000 and I have all my stuff 12/12 plus another spec of stuff 12/12 plus any Uber sitting in my stash is 12/12…like yeah silly I can’t group with friends or they get less
Yeap. It should be unlocked in W4. You can carry a level 1 in pit.
yeah or with a single unlock by beating a 100 dungeon
Either that or if it's easier just make the opener pay for every party member. I would take either.
That would get complicated with people leaving and joining mid run etc. far easier to just make everyone pay if they want in.
I love D4 but admit it's super frustrating to see the team not taking D3 lessons. Armory, summon mtls per group member (though I guess even D3 Uber bosses worked the same as D4), changing up abilities with the different runes, etc.
Yeah. The skill runes from D3 was a nice way to change skills even further. I hope they had something similar down the road. Adding fire damage to Tornado, or changing Blizzard to Lightning. Whatever it may be, just new ways to customize our builds for different synergies.
I swear I must have played a different version of D3 then the people on this sub. D3's rune system was literally a matter of which color of this skill gives me the highest damage output and you went with that every time. There was no choice involved. I really don't understand why some people seemed to like it so much.
It was. Certain runes were basically straight up downgrades compared to their counterparts. They were technically usable for easier content thanks to the insane scaling but that's basically what's happening now in d4 with certain poorly supported skills. Could you clear pit 61 with them? Probably yes. There's just no reason to do so outside of some kind of irrational attachment to the skill because there are plainly better alternatives.
I don't think that's necessarily true. There were tons of setups you could do depending on the rest of your gear and preference / playstyle. Even looking at the leaderboards and you'd see a half dozen or more setups for each of the builds.
because it is much better compared to the current skill system. While still being fairly bad but accessible and fun to play around during leveling.
I agree the current skilltree is kinda boring but I really hope they're not going the D3 route or else we'll be back to playing predefined builds again just like with D3's sets :(
it's already the case. With the iron wolf rep you receive a predefined build through aspects. Each class has one specific build. And sets will come with the new extension. This game is going to be d3 enhanced very soon
i think thats what the problem with a totally new entity taking over the prodution, it's like they're trying to refigure out everything.
I think what really irks me is that they will *eventually* do just this, and be all smiles and pat themselves on the back during campfire chats, joking “we heard you and we did this, hurhurhur” when it shouldnt have even been an issue in the first place. Im getting so tired of reading “this is a problem that has been solved” because its become par for the fucking course with this team. They dont know how to innovate because they lack a clear fundamental understanding of whats come before.
Does it cost materials to open a pit? Like I'm at 103 and I never knew... Cuz I never ran out I guess. Also I like abandoned alit of them so far lol.
It only costs 3 Runeshards no matter which tier you run, I think a lot of people have THOUSANDS of Runeshards.
Lol
The cost to open the rift should be zero. If I have to do an activity a stupid amount of times for the material required to upgrade my junk, the cost for that activity should be zero and everyone who goes in should get the same amount from the reward pool for doing the activity. The currency is not needed at all and is wasted programming. Same with reward throttling for people who didn't open the rift. Imagine going in with a full squad and having to rotate taking turns just to make it fair and then understanding the sheer volume of runs that will need to be made for a group of 4 because 3 out of 4 runs will be half progress on a material that escalates in amount needed.
I mean as it sits right now, it *is* effectively zero to open for the most part. I'm currently sitting on 7,279 Runeshards. I could run the Pit 2,426 times in a row before running out. So I'm not entirely sure the purpose behind the Runeshards. I would think either making it free to open *or* leaning into the opposite direction and making them harder to obtain. One option they could do, is making it so Runeshards only drop from one or two sources, like NMD's and World Bosses. However, this would limit the amount of Pit runs people do, and because of that I would think there would need to be a boost to the Pit materials gained at the end. You have to run a lot of Pits to Masterwork your gear as it stands already with them being practically free. I believe it was 130 Pit runs at Tier 101 to 100% Masterwork all your gear (without resets).
That it's tied to masterworking means you can't make it expensive (time or resources) to open. It's why I say just remove the cost completely or reduce the amount of times I need to do it to masterwork my crap.
Blizzard has to keep learning the same lessons over and over again.
We simply don't have the technology.
Amen. It’s like they want us to play solo only….
I like this idea I’ll vote for it
Yeap...feels like they purposely hold back on features just to release it in attemp impress us when they are having a bad season
Reptoids, Illuminati, Majestic 12
That seemed random. Care to elaborate?
Why?
Why?? So that a party of friends can participate in the Pit together and receive the same rewards. Currently, everyone else besides the person that opens the Pit receives 1/2 the amount of materials at the end. It encourages people to disband their parties and run the pit solo for maximum benefit, instead of friends playing together.
Why not just let everyone receive the reward? Why does it matter if the party uses the material that is a non issue?
I'm not sure I'm following what you're getting at. That's what I would like is for everyone to receive 100% of the materials they would normally earn whether it's solo, or in a party. Currently in a party of 4, one member pays 3 Runeshards to open the pit. The other three members in the party do not have to pay anything. All four members run the pit together, and at the end of the Pit the person that paid the Runeshards gets 100% of Masterworking Materials that they would normally earn, while the other members receive 50% of the materials they would normally earn. Effectively reducing the amount of materials they are earning for doing the same content they could have run solo.
This is why I do pit solo or I carry friends who aren't as geared as I am. Being disincentivized from running pits with people is a real bummer and I hope blizzard fixes it
It really sucks. Esspecially for my gf and I who couch coop and she doesn't farm like I do. Everytime something comes out it's met with WHAT ABOUT THE SOLO. As if they have to only play solo or its hard to msg in 1 of 3 forums LFG "boss".
Yeah it's pretty stupid because I played with a barb last night and we were fucking cruising through 101's at like 3 minutes. Pretty good synergy. This guy had the best gear I've ever seen to I don't know why he paid me I think it was just because he wanted to feel it out I open the pit and I see him come in with me and this is the first time that's ever happened and I'm on controller trying to type out and freaking out out out finally everything dies and I look at his gear and I'm like Jesus Christ what the fuck 3GA doombringer GA grandfather 4GA pain gorgers shaco tyrell's... Hardcore by the way Was fun though Yeah this was on hardcore so I'm thinking maybe he bought the account itself I don't know. Possible I did that shit like 20 years ago in dark age Camelot and then a couple other games I think. Wow
Buddy bought all of that, probably. Rmt for gold and then bought GAs with that gold.
Can’t buy mythic uniques, they are not tradeable. So 4 of the 5 things you listed were either drops for him or crafted
You can pay for either the boss mats or boss runs themselves though.
Not that you'd need to lol. The limiting factor on bossing at this point is how long it takes you to exit dungeon, reset, and resummon it.
Yea I know those paingorgers alone prolly ran them like 6 bil tho.
[удалено]
And? It's still stupid af. Even if it was a quarter.
[удалено]
Duuude, you can rake in $100M per hour?? I wish I knew how to do that. I had just crossed the $100M threshold on my lvl 100 druid after like 14 hours of playtime. Worth noting I never grinded for gold, but I also never spent a lot of gold on affix swaps or masterworking. $1B felt completely out of reach until I actually started listing items on the trading website.
I tend to combine selling items and boosting people on the pit, haven't done it in a while since I hit gold cap a couple times before the pit nerf but I was pulling way over 100M per hour
The problem with modern gaming.
This made me wonder, isnt it bannable to buy in game currency using real money?
Typically the stance is to ban sellers not buyers. If they banned all buyers half the population of the game would disappear over night
Yea for sure. Blizzard or any game company doesn't want rmt to happen because ot Yale play time and ultimately maybe money from their pockets.
This was on hardcore so I don't know
They shouldn't get more crafting mats from it for grouping. Group players should all have to put in their shards to join the Pit, and then just get the standard 100% of rewards, given they've put the same in to start it.
No one's asking to get more mats for grouping. They're asking to get the same mats for grouping. The party members that didn't open the instance get half the mats.
The OP did specifically ask for bonus materials from grouping. Specifically the same mats "+5 per group member".
groping makes monster have more health so better have the same mats drop.
Why?
Is that confirmed that stones only drop to those who open the pit?
Yes boss mats only drop for the person who put the summon mats in or, in this case, the Pit mats. That's how all boss mats work. Although in the case of Pits since stones aren't a guaranteed drop, I do kinda think they should change that.
Cor this is soo dumb it reminds me of the stash tabs all over again
Same if you group for other bosses that drop eggs and shards.
No it’s isn’t correct. eg whoever opened pears to get twice as much as the other. This is anecdotal but I could supply screen shots if I could be arsed 😂
Not for stygian stones. They can only drop for the opener.
Ah sorry, I stand corrected. I assumed we were also talking about masterwork mats - which aren’t “stones” - DOH! 😩
In the end it should be about choice and preference. Solo, group, changing it up. Everyone pays the same cost if there is one, if something costs 5 something then a group of 3 pays 15 total, and a solo player pays 5 and so on. That way you can play in whatever composition you like and it is fair to everyone. Nobody should get any extra exp, loot or whatever, not outside of increased efficiency. You should play in a group because you want to, not because it is best - same with solo play.
The real reason is they don't want grouping to be that much better than solo play. For a long ass time in D3 grouping was realistically the best way to play whether it be GRs, bounties, farming keys in normal rifts, or just leveling at the start of the season The disparity between solo play and group play was a problem they were looking to solve because if you were serious about pushing the ladder in D3 you *had* to group(bots aside)
I played WoW for a long time and stopped playing it because they made the game a chore by grinding daily’s and putting so much behind group quest (Mythic Dungeons, some raid quest etc.) I work third shift and play super late at night so I enjoy being a he to do everything solo. I do group a lot with my clan members but it have to be online earlier than normal to do it.
And yet they've made a game along the lines of an MMO, completely online, but people can't play in groups because they'll be penalized. That's got to be one of the top 10 decisions made at Blizzard.
D2 also had benefits playing with friends, the MF/rune drop rate went higher and increased exp gains. It's odd to me they are actively discouraging grouping.
[удалено]
Don’t give that “you know what D4 was when you bought it” bullshit. D4 is a completely different game now than since launch, and it’s the loud members of the community that have dictated the changes.
I like killing the mobs at my own pace. I've played every Diablo game and have grouped maybe 30 times with friends. I'm fine with people getting more mats or xp from grouping because they have to deal with the headache. Playing "who gets to the mob first" is boring af.
If people want to be antisocial that’s their problem. The devs shouldn’t be catering to gremlins that burn in sunlight. They should be catering to fun happy people that want to group up who are going to draw more people to the game. If they need an activity for miserable solo people fine have one but it should not give out vital materials needed for endgame. If those antisocial players want the good stuff they can do like they have to in every other game and learn to cooperate. This should not be the game for the kids that didn’t know how to play at school, it should be the game for the kids that did.
I feel like you didn't play d3 to a high level if you have these opinions Think of it the other way for a second. If you can push higher pit levels with more people by nature of how the game works, you'd feel almost pushed into it. Look at Uber boss runs. If you have a set, you run it, you get 1 boss kill. If you find 3 other people who each have a set and now you've 4x your materials effectively cutting down the time to run bosses by 4. Looking at it that way, playing solo seems like a pretty stupid idea no? They dont *want* to force people into group play. Like I said they're trying to solve the disparity between the two styles
I stopped playing D3 before RoS came out because the last stage of my professional training started and I didn’t have the time or inclination to laser things down for hours with disintegrate, sell for gold, buy another 10 DPS from the AH and keep going. I don’t really recognise D3 as an example of good anything to be honest - I’m not familiar with any of the endgame systems they eventually implemented, the game looked like rainbow vomit, all I know is it had infinite scaling and lots of colours and everything was free. I am unashamedly in favour of pushing people to play together. They won’t do it by themselves. I want to feel forced to group up and I want everyone else to feel forced to group up too. If they got on comms they might actually have some fun, win or lose. I came to D4 from Destiny 2 and greatly enjoyed being good enough at that game to carry and teach other players, being needed by other players and needing them to perform too. I want co-op Diablo, not solo Diablo, and that means I need the game designed to force people to play together. It’s like pulling teeth getting people to do anything more than like a 2x rotation off comms right now. Everybody has to feed the kids, talk to the spouse, water the swingset, mow the pool, have their third nap of the day, play something else, etc etc etc. I want people playing Diablo 4 together lol. Will say it loudly and proudly. Does not bother me one bit. If the game suddenly couldn’t be played without a ride or die team of 4 that would suit me just fine.
i be fine if they make ssf mode while doing it otherwise it's back to POE/LE for me. I enjoy ARPGs solo.
As they said in campfire chat "since solo players felt inefficient running bosses like duriel without the group, we felt like making an activity where it wouldn't be beneficial to run in a party, even if you could" I mean, I guess, but common blizz, there are better ways.
or they could solve the actual problem and make grouping/matchmaking an easily accessible in-game thing.
That would be fine if pits wasn’t required for masterworking
Or... Fix that problem rather than create new ones. Make every activity require mats from every participant. Instant equality. Edit... Or, to allow friends to play together even if they don't have mats... let a player join without mats for free for a token reward, or pay mats to gain full rewards. Like the maiden, but a bit more extreme.
Meanwhile my friend doing hardcore put carries making 1.5b gold per hour.
Not very different than softcore. Carries vary from 30M to 50M per run and some average 2 minutes per clear. Can do around 20 runs per hour maybe 25 in some crazy case where players rarely go sell/salvage and just pick up mats and GA. Should be more in hardcore IMO.
I can make gold from carries?!
Yes, through diablo trade or trade chat.
Paying gold for a carry in soft core is insane 😂
Probably rmt'ers Like why even play at that point
There's way more gold in the economy in softcore because it's easier to bot
Why do people have to run 20 pits and not have enough mats to upgrade to 12. Ugh.
And then your 12 masterwork is a shitty one and you get to start all over.
My friends take turns opening so we each get a chance at a full reward
I'm guessing it's because they don't want people to carry. But I'm sure there's a better workaround than that possible.
Are there materials needed to start a pit?! I have never used any.
Runeshards
Bronze iirc
I really don't see why group play in the Pit should be disincentivized. When you are pushing you don't really care about the rewards anyways, for speed runs it hardly matters and the materials to enter the Pit should just be removed completely. They could add the condition that every player in the group has to unlock tier levels themselves, so you cannot get carried by others to farm mats.
It also makes the pit more difficult.. so you're both being punished, and the one not paying for the pit gets half the rewards. That makes sense.. /s
How is it, that I see these posts daily now and all of them up voted, while I made the exact same post (without stygian knowledge), and I got down voted to hell and laughed at from every single comment, that "everyone knows it because it's daily posted"? Typical reddit behavior 😂
Pits need leaderboards
Because afaik pits are the only thing related to individual progression
They should just make it like D3 was with GR keys, if you're in a group and accept starting a pit it uses everyones runeshards, just like everyone who wanted to participate in the gr had to have keys. And everyone should get full mats and equal chances of stones. Spend the runesgards, get the loots, simple.
But how do they keep you guys playing!!! Lol blizz is all about money they will delay this feature till S6 and say it's new
The idea was to avoid the thing people have with uber roations, where the "correct" way to play is to do it with multiple people rotating who pays to get more tries for less resources. But they're not rare, so it doesn't matter at all, and ultimately, if they really cared, they would've just made everyone require keys. It's a half assed solution to a nonexistent problem.
I would actually play D4 if I could skip the open world, Helltides, and nightmare dungeons and just level entirely though The Pit like we can in D3. I’ll die on the hill that D3 right now is still a better game than D4 tbh 🤷♂️
Opening a pit requires mats? First time I heard that
For real man! When my mates and I do pits it feels so awkward that all 4 of us have to go into pits solo just so we get the same amount instead of going all in together and have some shits and giggles
Im just gonna throw it out here, i love the idea that we have like a good handful of different content I dont like the idea of having a dozen+n types of summoning mats. My first few afternoons in WT4 was literally just googling what is what lol
Don't need the bonus to incentivize grouping, just make everyone get the same amount of materials. You should not be punished for playing with friends.
Isn't there a stacking debuff that kills you on certain non pit bosses too? I played multiplayer once and playing those same bosses sucked compared to solving them. Felt punished when playing multiplayer.
Why? Because of people giving absolute trash opinions like [this one](https://www.reddit.com/r/diablo4/comments/1cionbv/diablo_iv_patch_notes_season_4/l2akxky/) and Blizzard listening to them.
I wasn't aware someone was taking advantage of me, only they wanted to open the pit and wouldn't enter if I initiated it. Only figured out after a few rounds I was getting half the amount I usually get. It's a real put off, I have no idea why anyone would want to do pits in groups. I only do it solo now.
[удалено]
Pits are probably the thing you spend the most time doing though. It's dumb to have that thing be the one that you can really only do solo. My group wouldn't mind the inefficiency of the hp scaling, that would be worth it to have fun together, but not having styg drop, and only getting half of mats is ridiculous.
I few things i hope they change with pit 1. Everyone put their mats and everyone get equal mats. 2. Simpler maps with least diverted path 3. Spawn near where we die, not in a couple Of block away. 4. Potions drop faster. 5. Certain tedious maps should be removed.
Heya just a recent tip I found out to kinda help with #3 in boss room - if you teleport to the guardian chamber and walk slightly backwards to "unfog" that section of the map, when you die you will respawn in the guardian chamber instead of being thrown back 100 rooms.
Thanks for the tip, seem like an oversight from the dev if this is possible.
So many posts on here saying why doesn't bliz make this easier, why don't they just remove required mats. The game is ridiculously easy already to a point where it's almost brain dead boring. Make it harder. Make people grind and farm mats for END GAME. Non of this spoon fed retard shit.
The game has only got easier and easier since launch. The new expansion will probably make it an idle auto clicker game. Do literally nothing and Shacos rain from the sky.
most antisocial social game ever
Why is bossing solo disincentivised?
It's better to get more drops per boss summon because summon mats are incredibly tedious to farm. And whether you're solo or in a group, the boss dies in 2 seconds anyway.
Bli$$ard: because f\*\*\* you thats why :)
because solo players cried about bosses and blizzard is too stupid to just make everyone pay the fee which would fix both systems
It’s deliberate. They don’t want us grouping up to do things faster or have more fun. They want us kinda miserable, kinda stuck in a loop, suffering alone, hoping the general grind will change our fortunes (spoiler: it doesn’t, only grinding the Pit for hours and hours does that). If they let us play the way we want, they can’t control the taps and levers that make us spend more or less time in the game, giving them better metrics and chances of cosmetic sales. We are here to be slaves to Blizzard and feel like we’re having fun while we do it. Nothing else. Group Pit is fun, sharing the burden of all that farming feels good, therefore it must be disincentivised as it would give players options and agency. Those are bad things for Blizzard. People need to understand, they want us to be unsatisfied, the same way a food manufacturer puts ALMOST enough sugar into their food so you keep eating it. It’s just the way it is. Should they change it? Absolutely. Will they? I doubt it. They’ve been penalising group play from launch.
That's one melodramatic post about an ARPG game. More people play the game solo than grouped obviously otherwise they'd go all in on group play.
More people play the game solo than grouped because they are punished for grouping instead of incentivised. People ran NMDs together before they made it a 100% monster health increase for every additional person. When it was only an 80% increase there was an incentive to group up and people did. An incentive that by the way had ZERO impact on someone who wanted to play alone. The best features since launch? Always involve other people. Everyone loved the ‘blood tides’, said it was great to see more people around, they loved the event. Look at the ‘tech farm’ from last season, again, everyone loved playing together and complimented the ease of joining in the fun + getting progression at the same time. Same with being able to level in Helltide now and Blood Maiden. The Vault was complimented for packing vendors and players together and actually feeling like a gathering place, so they made all towns like that. They only DISINCENTIVISE group play when they want to control how long your grind is and how good your odds are of ever getting your character to where you want. Otherwise they’re happy to make collaborative play part of the game and they always get praise for doing it.
Solo pits requires 3 runeshard, if a party of 4 enters, each one pays 1 runeshard and they get extra rewards for giving an extra runeshard, makes it even more rewarding doing group pits and of course the mobs and the boss should scale by the number of party members.
Just make them all pay 3 and all get the same amount of pit materials?
D4 is not d3 ….Stop it!!!! Not the same devs and not the same game. It’s like saying why does d4 not learn from titan quest or grim dawn. They are different gamessssssss…….
It's a pretty stupid move to not carry over good quality of life to a sequel. Why would you want the sequel to be a worse product?
It's all playtime and bs metrics like that. They want each individual player to have to run the pit as the leader to have a shot at a stone. It's very anti player. Something Blizz has been fluent in lately.
This is not true. They said in a campfire that this is because of the anger over the Duriel grouping meta. Get your shit straight
This is the correct answer, those have been rampant since Duriel’s release.(The anger is understandable to a degree, but as it is a live service game, group play will likely be favored in the end) But it shouldn’t be a surprise they’ve reacted this way
Oh, okay, sorry. I'm sure ppl won't lie about anything to keep the mob at bay, so you're probably right to assume they would never lie to us about Anything.
Trilateral commission, Area 51, fibre cabal
Your tinfoil hat is showing
Every single other piece of content disincentivizes solo play, deal with it
They hated him, for he spoke the truth.
What are you talking about? Get some friends lol
What? So your rationale is i get fucked, so you should too??? No wonder you play solo. No one wants to play with a shitty attitude like that anyway.
Yep but this is who the devs are developing for. The bitter edgy kids who can’t make any friends and want their happy chemicals NOW with no one else involved.