I'd just say it's because 40k players are not willing to invest their limited time into learning a new system. Especially because 40k games already take a while, they'd rather just play a game they know and enjoy instead of trying something new they might not like.
I can relate. I probably have enough compatible kill teams for a small game of 40k, but no interest whatsoever to learn that system if I could rather play Kill Team.
Same. Little interest in 40k proper, big interest in killteam. I'm sure if I were already invested in the latter id be hesitant to swap to the former. I guess that goes with most game systems. I want to play necromunda but I am invested in playing killteam.
It's literally this, most of the time it's the commitment they make when buying a version of the game. So most of the time you usually catch players like this if they have free time or they get burnt out on their game. We started a group here in Vegas and started small with me and two other guys. We kept showing up on time each week and now we get 8 to 12 players on our Tuesdays we get 5 to 8 Saturdays and tournaments well we get 20+ some coming from other states. But most of the players we got were guys who bought the game before 40k. Most that play 40k won't switch but some that do comes when they need a break from their game. I recommend doing what I did, start a discord be the event maker, and get others to show. After it grew I handed it off because I'm working on underworlds now lol.
I've been pretty active in my town last year to try to expand the hobby : doing initiations in my FLGS, doing initiations at my house, at other's people houses, hosted a tournament, hang out at my FLGS in order to help people who seem interested in KT.
I also use an app for gamers looking to play.
Numbers of 40k players in my region (they don't necessarily are single and do not want to meet me) : 50.
Numbers of KT players : 3 (me included).
I sent 33 texts yesterday to all 40K players in the app. Got 4 answers : no/no/not interested in 40k (why u are on the app then, you git ???) / ok.
So it is really a long-term commitment. But let's face it : last year, I was alone with a buddy to play KT. Now, I have another frequent player (we play every week), 5-6 occasionnal players.
It is starting to pay off, little by little.
We’ve been running KT evenings/events for over 18 months. We’ve not really attracted many 40k players but our player base has steadily grown from single digits of players to about 25-30.
It’s just taken time to build that player base.
People who are already playing 40k may have miniatures, but likely have limited time and don't want to branch out, and they prefer to focus on one system.
Whether or not there are players will largely dependant on your local meta. It's a bit of a snowball effect - if there are games being played and seems like the game is alive, people are more likely to get started, which means more games will be played, and so on. Where I live, it's super active, and there's virtually zero overlap between people who play 40k and KT.
For me, the advantage of KT is that I don't have to paint the entire army, don't have to lug the entire army around, and the games take reasonable amount of time.
In my local game club, a few players were interested but there was no scene before I came. Then I managed to get those players to play, then the players from 30/40k saw the game was alive, and so more joined. It’s kind of a circle : people want to be sure they’ll have the opportunity to play if they invest time and/or money in the game system. It took some time to build the community.
Furthermore, these last few weeks, a good number of disappointed 40k players asked for an intro game, to see if kill team suits them better. Seems like that game system hasn’t evolved enough in the past years, compared to KT which feels more compelling and balanced. Give it time!
Part of the resistance from 40k players probably comes from the stigma Kill Team had in its previous iterations. It really was just a slimmed down version of its big brother, and actually an inferior game compared to the "full experience" of 40k.
When I've taught the game to 40k players they're invariably surprised how the game mechanics between the two are completely different.
Depends on your location probably. Where i am we have a local group of about 30 regular players, and the broader regional crowd is in the hundreds.
Most of the KT crowd here are a bit older as it fits better around real life. If the hobby crowd in your area biases young that might explain some of it
Sucks that there arent more where you are, get promoting!
From my experience 40k players and KT players are 2 distinct groups.
KT community is the relatively new players, who got into the hobby through killteam in the last 2 years. Maybe tried to move on to 40k, but they found out that the game system just sucks and stayed with KT in the end.
40k community are the veterans, who have been playing the game for 5+ years and they don't really like change. I have heard multiple 40k people say, that they enjoyed KT that 1 time they played it, but apparently they didn't like it enough to dedicate time and energy into playing it ever again.
The second group is much, much larger. Exceptions still exist ofc.
What steps do you recommend? Not to pull the lame “I have anxiety” card but I find it really hard to approach people. Part of the reason I started the hobby was to get out of my comfort zone but I’ve found it pretty difficult to meet welcoming people to start playing. If doesn’t help that I’m a complete newcomer to tabletop games in general.
Really love painting and modeling and I feel like I’d love the game too but my only friend who enjoys stuff like warhammer moved 6 hours away /:
I’d recommend teaming up with an established game store in your area that has a good reputation. Let them know that you want to start a Kill Team league, and then hopefully you can advertise on their discord or other channels. Stick to the same evening and pick one without competing table top events. Then, Stay with it, people might not come out right away, but the longer you host a game night and if you’re consistent and reliable, the community will build.
Hey man id just like to say thanks. I asked the game shop I frequent the most which is the largest in my city and they said they didn’t really have a scene but they pointed me towards a mom and pop game shop that doesn’t even show up on google.
Gave them a call and they have about 10 guys that run Killteam every Tuesday and the owner said he’d be happy to run an intro game with me before most people start showing up. Wish me luck!
I’d start with some demo games and demo painting sessions in your local club to draw people.
Then once you have at least 6 ppl interested, start organizing casual tournaments, allowing people with unpainted armies.
Once you hit the 12 ppl attendance, softly introduce battle ready level of painting.
The most important but is regularity: any event you’re gonna run must happen every time you announce it, even if there are not enough participants - it’s is important for ppl to see that if they come, it happens
Kill team 2.0 also has a higher bar of entry in terrain and a lot of people don't want to invest in (usually they prefer to buy more army models)
Having a local store have each season of terrain is even difficult at times.
But I think this is very regional and local people championing the game at local stores can greatly increase a player base but it does take time and effort.
Honestly, KT is very complicated and not as simple as a skirmish game should be if you want new players. Around here, I've seen time and again where a 40k player gives it a shot, is thrown off by the complexity, and gives up. The Warcry community in my area is way bigger than the KT community, and a lot of that has to do with how simple Warcry is. Lots of the Warcry players are actually KT converts.
This. I loved KT 1.0, KT 2.0 just feels slow and doesnt hit the same. Also not being able to make my own lists anymore annoyed me, suddenly I couldnt use 3 of my KTs.
I got back into this hobby when I bought Kill Team Octarius box at release. I discovered a local gaming group and the first week I went along I played a game and there was 1 other game running alongside ours. I'm fairly certain we got all the rules wrong because it is not explained well in the rulebook and/or isn't particularly intuitive. I have been at the club most weeks since then (2+ years) and I've never seen another game of it. Every other GW game is represented regularly (+ plenty of non-GW games). There have been Warcry, Necromunda, and Mordheim campaigns so there is plenty of interest in skirmish games. Every time it comes up in discussion, the difficulty of understanding certain rules always comes up - I'm sure it's simple enough once you know it, but as written in the rulebooks it's a struggle. Compare to Warcry where whenever it comes up, everyone wants to play it because it's so simple, even the more 40K focused players.
Trying to convert 40k hardcore players into kill team doesn’t seem to work in my experience. Converting CASUAL 40k players who find 40k to be just tedious and boring works much better.
But really just find a store you can play in and setup a regular meetup. Be consistent. Over time it will build. Make a discord or Facebook group and get the word out. Theres a lot more kill team players out there than commonly thought.
We started with 2 to four people at our game night, and now they’re organizing monthly 16 person tournaments that sell out! But it takes time and consistency.
Last year i was traveling for work and spent a few months in a town with a really nice game store but hardly anyone played kill team and the discord didnt even have a kill team channel. So from the ground up i built interest in the skirmish game drawing in the attention of anyone that would listen to me ramble and by the time i left they had a full little kill team community with a healthy mix of casual and competitive players
I still hate that i had to leave right as they started their first tournament though
For me, simply, it's the perceived convoluted nature of the rules...
I was hugely excited when I first heard of kill team. Grabbed an octarius set mostly for the rules, but figured I'd see what I could field from my salamanders.
Then, life kinda got busy, and I didn't get around to painting, but I did follow the sub to try and learn what I could, and slowly got more discouraged.
There were discussions of how that cool compendium I got wasn't going to give me as many options s as I thought, and it was outdated anyway as errata was catching up, and the teams listed weren't really that good.
There was talk of how many boxes one would gave to buy to make a team in my 'smaller' game of kill team.
Then there were rules questions. Tactics cards, ploys clarifications, and holy cow LOS and cover.
More and more, it seemed to be less if a tactical miniatures wargame, and more of a test of how well you know all the rules- for both you and your opponent's team - and how well you could exploit them with careful positioning so I can shoot you, but you can't shoot back.
I stress this is a perception, and solely my perception and may be completely incorrect (is almost certainly at least partially incorrect). But the question seemed to be 'why aren't more people into KT' and it seems to me that perceived issue with the complexity and nature of the rules could be an entry barrier. It kinda is for me...
Imo KT has been the outlier for even having as much interest as it does. For all its flaws, 40k will always be what people play. I've gotten distracted with so many specialist games (GW and otherwise) and even when they're good, there's no lasting community after a year or so of launch. If getting games in is your top priority in a game system, I'm resigned to it having to be 40k.
That said, the KT2.0 rules are amazing and if you have 1-2 people hooked and ready to play games, I'd call that a success.
The main reason: 40K is established, if sb likes the universe or is passionate about miniatures probably has/buys this. Time is limited and there are not enough new players to fuel Kill Team, gen Z is not so much into miniwargaming from my observation. Moreover the fact that GW is not pushing Kill Team hard enough doesn't help.
its funny because my group got into KT specifically because it required NOT 100 model armies lol, but everyone else in my pod are soooo slow to build, paint, and learn their armies that I'm on my 5 one painting/learning with the joke being that one person has decided to not even bother getting a team because he could borrow one of mine lol.
i think 40k and KT just requires a real dedication to spending an evening doing it and that's tricky to get a lot of people to do when there are other recreational options that dont require lugging around so many pieces
90% of people don't actually want to do anything. They want to get home from work and do their own thing. 'Kt is too time consuming' bro ur about to watch a stream for 3 hours... sigh
If you're of a disposition to change it you should try asking one of your FLGS who sells GW products to allow you to host a Learn To Play night at their store and advertise it on their social media? Have a couple of boards set up with some different teams (highly recommend Intercessors) and then walk people thru playing.
Sometimes you have to create it from the ground up. We've had a lot of luck building up our scene here locally and are now regularly at 10+ people on KT night. It does take time tho.
Overall GW market 40k more as the poster child, with KT being an alternative boxed game.
My city has a pretty solid and rockin' KT crew and I've seen/heard a few other clubs get frequent KT representation. So I'd say it's also location dependent.
Because Kill team has trouble not being seen as 'starter 40k' instead of its own system. Nevermind that it's a far more balanced system than the games of 40k I've played.
/s
But seriously, I’ve dived into KT as I have less play time and more painting time to raise my models to a handful of moderately painted dudes instead of a whole lot that eventually hit mediocre.
Can't say for you, but for me, it mostly has to do with the fact I live in the middle of Bumfuck Nowhere where most people do not even know what 40k is and have little interest discovering it. And that pretty much apply for any tabletop wargame.
Most people play what the local community plays.
If you start with a game, and then try to find people instead of the other way around almost any game can be difficult to find players for if you are unlucky.
Where I play, I could have picked kill team, 40k, AOS, star wars legions, marvel crisis blabla, Infinity, any number of card games etc, but if I had started by deciding to play Warcry I would be in your seat right now.
I have a few kill teams and play every so often, but I felt that I either misunderstood what I was getting into, or that I was mis-sold. I was hoping for something that was quicker and less involved than 40K. Kill team is complex and can take a long time. I might as as well play a larger game with all my models.
As a 40k player, and enjoyer of other skirmish games (Crisis protocol, Shatterpoint), I was pretty down for KT 1.0 which was 40k Lite. KT 2.0 felt like learning an entirely new game, and imo GW is pretty behind in Skirmish game design.
I think part of it is that after someone has spent hundreds or thousands of dollars on a 40k army and spent hours upon hours painting all their units, including vehicles, they want to use all of their army instead of one single squad.
I have one friend to play Kill Team with, and I consider myself lucky. My LGS group is uninterested
I'd just say it's because 40k players are not willing to invest their limited time into learning a new system. Especially because 40k games already take a while, they'd rather just play a game they know and enjoy instead of trying something new they might not like.
I can relate. I probably have enough compatible kill teams for a small game of 40k, but no interest whatsoever to learn that system if I could rather play Kill Team.
Same. Little interest in 40k proper, big interest in killteam. I'm sure if I were already invested in the latter id be hesitant to swap to the former. I guess that goes with most game systems. I want to play necromunda but I am invested in playing killteam.
It's literally this, most of the time it's the commitment they make when buying a version of the game. So most of the time you usually catch players like this if they have free time or they get burnt out on their game. We started a group here in Vegas and started small with me and two other guys. We kept showing up on time each week and now we get 8 to 12 players on our Tuesdays we get 5 to 8 Saturdays and tournaments well we get 20+ some coming from other states. But most of the players we got were guys who bought the game before 40k. Most that play 40k won't switch but some that do comes when they need a break from their game. I recommend doing what I did, start a discord be the event maker, and get others to show. After it grew I handed it off because I'm working on underworlds now lol.
I've been pretty active in my town last year to try to expand the hobby : doing initiations in my FLGS, doing initiations at my house, at other's people houses, hosted a tournament, hang out at my FLGS in order to help people who seem interested in KT. I also use an app for gamers looking to play. Numbers of 40k players in my region (they don't necessarily are single and do not want to meet me) : 50. Numbers of KT players : 3 (me included). I sent 33 texts yesterday to all 40K players in the app. Got 4 answers : no/no/not interested in 40k (why u are on the app then, you git ???) / ok. So it is really a long-term commitment. But let's face it : last year, I was alone with a buddy to play KT. Now, I have another frequent player (we play every week), 5-6 occasionnal players. It is starting to pay off, little by little.
>I also use an app for gamers looking to play What app? I've only found regional discords centered around the GW store 1.5 hrs away.
I am in France. We have "MyHobby App".
OkCupid
Yes, keep building a scene! You are doing the emperor’s work right there.
We’ve been running KT evenings/events for over 18 months. We’ve not really attracted many 40k players but our player base has steadily grown from single digits of players to about 25-30. It’s just taken time to build that player base.
People who are already playing 40k may have miniatures, but likely have limited time and don't want to branch out, and they prefer to focus on one system. Whether or not there are players will largely dependant on your local meta. It's a bit of a snowball effect - if there are games being played and seems like the game is alive, people are more likely to get started, which means more games will be played, and so on. Where I live, it's super active, and there's virtually zero overlap between people who play 40k and KT. For me, the advantage of KT is that I don't have to paint the entire army, don't have to lug the entire army around, and the games take reasonable amount of time.
In my local game club, a few players were interested but there was no scene before I came. Then I managed to get those players to play, then the players from 30/40k saw the game was alive, and so more joined. It’s kind of a circle : people want to be sure they’ll have the opportunity to play if they invest time and/or money in the game system. It took some time to build the community. Furthermore, these last few weeks, a good number of disappointed 40k players asked for an intro game, to see if kill team suits them better. Seems like that game system hasn’t evolved enough in the past years, compared to KT which feels more compelling and balanced. Give it time!
Part of the resistance from 40k players probably comes from the stigma Kill Team had in its previous iterations. It really was just a slimmed down version of its big brother, and actually an inferior game compared to the "full experience" of 40k. When I've taught the game to 40k players they're invariably surprised how the game mechanics between the two are completely different.
Depends on your location probably. Where i am we have a local group of about 30 regular players, and the broader regional crowd is in the hundreds. Most of the KT crowd here are a bit older as it fits better around real life. If the hobby crowd in your area biases young that might explain some of it Sucks that there arent more where you are, get promoting!
https://preview.redd.it/thokhmi9yyhc1.jpeg?width=888&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=56aa696a86c290fc80d231934014925e18007e80
From my experience 40k players and KT players are 2 distinct groups. KT community is the relatively new players, who got into the hobby through killteam in the last 2 years. Maybe tried to move on to 40k, but they found out that the game system just sucks and stayed with KT in the end. 40k community are the veterans, who have been playing the game for 5+ years and they don't really like change. I have heard multiple 40k people say, that they enjoyed KT that 1 time they played it, but apparently they didn't like it enough to dedicate time and energy into playing it ever again. The second group is much, much larger. Exceptions still exist ofc.
If there is no community around you, it’s a great opportunity to start is yourself)
What steps do you recommend? Not to pull the lame “I have anxiety” card but I find it really hard to approach people. Part of the reason I started the hobby was to get out of my comfort zone but I’ve found it pretty difficult to meet welcoming people to start playing. If doesn’t help that I’m a complete newcomer to tabletop games in general. Really love painting and modeling and I feel like I’d love the game too but my only friend who enjoys stuff like warhammer moved 6 hours away /:
I’d recommend teaming up with an established game store in your area that has a good reputation. Let them know that you want to start a Kill Team league, and then hopefully you can advertise on their discord or other channels. Stick to the same evening and pick one without competing table top events. Then, Stay with it, people might not come out right away, but the longer you host a game night and if you’re consistent and reliable, the community will build.
Hey man id just like to say thanks. I asked the game shop I frequent the most which is the largest in my city and they said they didn’t really have a scene but they pointed me towards a mom and pop game shop that doesn’t even show up on google. Gave them a call and they have about 10 guys that run Killteam every Tuesday and the owner said he’d be happy to run an intro game with me before most people start showing up. Wish me luck!
Good luck! Hopefully you like the people, and enjoy the game. Post some updates of your team, and results! I’m really happy you found something!
I’d start with some demo games and demo painting sessions in your local club to draw people. Then once you have at least 6 ppl interested, start organizing casual tournaments, allowing people with unpainted armies. Once you hit the 12 ppl attendance, softly introduce battle ready level of painting. The most important but is regularity: any event you’re gonna run must happen every time you announce it, even if there are not enough participants - it’s is important for ppl to see that if they come, it happens
Kill team 2.0 also has a higher bar of entry in terrain and a lot of people don't want to invest in (usually they prefer to buy more army models) Having a local store have each season of terrain is even difficult at times. But I think this is very regional and local people championing the game at local stores can greatly increase a player base but it does take time and effort.
Honestly, KT is very complicated and not as simple as a skirmish game should be if you want new players. Around here, I've seen time and again where a 40k player gives it a shot, is thrown off by the complexity, and gives up. The Warcry community in my area is way bigger than the KT community, and a lot of that has to do with how simple Warcry is. Lots of the Warcry players are actually KT converts.
This. I loved KT 1.0, KT 2.0 just feels slow and doesnt hit the same. Also not being able to make my own lists anymore annoyed me, suddenly I couldnt use 3 of my KTs.
I got back into this hobby when I bought Kill Team Octarius box at release. I discovered a local gaming group and the first week I went along I played a game and there was 1 other game running alongside ours. I'm fairly certain we got all the rules wrong because it is not explained well in the rulebook and/or isn't particularly intuitive. I have been at the club most weeks since then (2+ years) and I've never seen another game of it. Every other GW game is represented regularly (+ plenty of non-GW games). There have been Warcry, Necromunda, and Mordheim campaigns so there is plenty of interest in skirmish games. Every time it comes up in discussion, the difficulty of understanding certain rules always comes up - I'm sure it's simple enough once you know it, but as written in the rulebooks it's a struggle. Compare to Warcry where whenever it comes up, everyone wants to play it because it's so simple, even the more 40K focused players.
Trying to convert 40k hardcore players into kill team doesn’t seem to work in my experience. Converting CASUAL 40k players who find 40k to be just tedious and boring works much better. But really just find a store you can play in and setup a regular meetup. Be consistent. Over time it will build. Make a discord or Facebook group and get the word out. Theres a lot more kill team players out there than commonly thought. We started with 2 to four people at our game night, and now they’re organizing monthly 16 person tournaments that sell out! But it takes time and consistency.
Where are you physically, out of curiosity?
Last year i was traveling for work and spent a few months in a town with a really nice game store but hardly anyone played kill team and the discord didnt even have a kill team channel. So from the ground up i built interest in the skirmish game drawing in the attention of anyone that would listen to me ramble and by the time i left they had a full little kill team community with a healthy mix of casual and competitive players I still hate that i had to leave right as they started their first tournament though
For me, simply, it's the perceived convoluted nature of the rules... I was hugely excited when I first heard of kill team. Grabbed an octarius set mostly for the rules, but figured I'd see what I could field from my salamanders. Then, life kinda got busy, and I didn't get around to painting, but I did follow the sub to try and learn what I could, and slowly got more discouraged. There were discussions of how that cool compendium I got wasn't going to give me as many options s as I thought, and it was outdated anyway as errata was catching up, and the teams listed weren't really that good. There was talk of how many boxes one would gave to buy to make a team in my 'smaller' game of kill team. Then there were rules questions. Tactics cards, ploys clarifications, and holy cow LOS and cover. More and more, it seemed to be less if a tactical miniatures wargame, and more of a test of how well you know all the rules- for both you and your opponent's team - and how well you could exploit them with careful positioning so I can shoot you, but you can't shoot back. I stress this is a perception, and solely my perception and may be completely incorrect (is almost certainly at least partially incorrect). But the question seemed to be 'why aren't more people into KT' and it seems to me that perceived issue with the complexity and nature of the rules could be an entry barrier. It kinda is for me...
Imo KT has been the outlier for even having as much interest as it does. For all its flaws, 40k will always be what people play. I've gotten distracted with so many specialist games (GW and otherwise) and even when they're good, there's no lasting community after a year or so of launch. If getting games in is your top priority in a game system, I'm resigned to it having to be 40k. That said, the KT2.0 rules are amazing and if you have 1-2 people hooked and ready to play games, I'd call that a success.
The main reason: 40K is established, if sb likes the universe or is passionate about miniatures probably has/buys this. Time is limited and there are not enough new players to fuel Kill Team, gen Z is not so much into miniwargaming from my observation. Moreover the fact that GW is not pushing Kill Team hard enough doesn't help.
its funny because my group got into KT specifically because it required NOT 100 model armies lol, but everyone else in my pod are soooo slow to build, paint, and learn their armies that I'm on my 5 one painting/learning with the joke being that one person has decided to not even bother getting a team because he could borrow one of mine lol. i think 40k and KT just requires a real dedication to spending an evening doing it and that's tricky to get a lot of people to do when there are other recreational options that dont require lugging around so many pieces
In my club there's two kind of players. The 40k hardcore gamers and the rest of the mortals. There's no cross between them
90% of people don't actually want to do anything. They want to get home from work and do their own thing. 'Kt is too time consuming' bro ur about to watch a stream for 3 hours... sigh
If you're of a disposition to change it you should try asking one of your FLGS who sells GW products to allow you to host a Learn To Play night at their store and advertise it on their social media? Have a couple of boards set up with some different teams (highly recommend Intercessors) and then walk people thru playing. Sometimes you have to create it from the ground up. We've had a lot of luck building up our scene here locally and are now regularly at 10+ people on KT night. It does take time tho.
Overall GW market 40k more as the poster child, with KT being an alternative boxed game. My city has a pretty solid and rockin' KT crew and I've seen/heard a few other clubs get frequent KT representation. So I'd say it's also location dependent.
Because Kill team has trouble not being seen as 'starter 40k' instead of its own system. Nevermind that it's a far more balanced system than the games of 40k I've played.
Using 8th Ed numbers, I have somewhere around 18,000 points of Imperium alone. Why would I want to only bring ten models?
/s But seriously, I’ve dived into KT as I have less play time and more painting time to raise my models to a handful of moderately painted dudes instead of a whole lot that eventually hit mediocre.
Can't say for you, but for me, it mostly has to do with the fact I live in the middle of Bumfuck Nowhere where most people do not even know what 40k is and have little interest discovering it. And that pretty much apply for any tabletop wargame.
Some people might just enjoy the spectacle of those massive 40k games and don't want to play a small scale
Most people play what the local community plays. If you start with a game, and then try to find people instead of the other way around almost any game can be difficult to find players for if you are unlucky. Where I play, I could have picked kill team, 40k, AOS, star wars legions, marvel crisis blabla, Infinity, any number of card games etc, but if I had started by deciding to play Warcry I would be in your seat right now.
I have a few kill teams and play every so often, but I felt that I either misunderstood what I was getting into, or that I was mis-sold. I was hoping for something that was quicker and less involved than 40K. Kill team is complex and can take a long time. I might as as well play a larger game with all my models.
As a 40k player, and enjoyer of other skirmish games (Crisis protocol, Shatterpoint), I was pretty down for KT 1.0 which was 40k Lite. KT 2.0 felt like learning an entirely new game, and imo GW is pretty behind in Skirmish game design.
To be brief, I think another huge factor is how limited the model selection is. Tau without battleships, guard without any mechanised units, etc.
I think part of it is that after someone has spent hundreds or thousands of dollars on a 40k army and spent hours upon hours painting all their units, including vehicles, they want to use all of their army instead of one single squad. I have one friend to play Kill Team with, and I consider myself lucky. My LGS group is uninterested