There definitely needs to be more regulation around smart devices, but this bill doesn't really seem to do an awful lot - now manufacturers will need to print "this device contains a microphone to support voice commands" but they can still save and send all those recordings to god knows where.
Would be much better to have laws around data privacy instead, if anything this law is just a distraction.
It's kinda like our Proposition 65 carcinogen warning law in California. Good intent but without context, all that happened was lots of warning on lots of things since lots of chemicals are carcinogenic, without explanation of dosage, exposure, duration, accumulation, etc.
I mean, that's basically how the majority of "this device spies on you" works. If it's networked or voice activated, it has to spy on you. That's part of how the feature works. If people are concerned about appliances spying on them, don't pay extra for one that has built in spy features.
I mean it is reasonable to want to buy an item with voice commands that doesn’t record every sound in your house so the company can sell every private conversation you have.
They already can't. This bill is doing fuck-all to stop any real problem.
If a company wants to sell your data, you need to sign an EULA that releases that data, like FaceBook or Twitter has.
If they were to record you, then sell that data without you signing anything that allows it, that's a clear breach of the Consumer Protection Act prohibiting deceptive business practiced through omission.
Basically Cruz's bill will do literally nothing other than make products that obviously have listening devises in them say they do, which you have to be an actual neanderthal to not understand a device need a microphone to hear you.
> They already can't. [...] If a company wants to sell your data, you need to sign an EULA that releases that data
That's a complex way to say "they actually can". There's a reason the EU made it illegal to claim consent with a clause buried in an EULA. EULAs are way too complex, to the point they have little legal power in contexts where *informed* consent is required.
What hes saying is that voice command features don't work without the spying, so no it's not reasonable to want them and not be spied on.
Don't buy their product, it's not hard.
For those who don't know, the way these voice commands work is it's always recording from a microphone. When it recognizes the simple activate command it saves the last 30 seconds or so of audio it recorded and sends it to a central server for processing to find out what you said and search up the response.
If you don't want them keeping your conversations then force your politicians to write a law that they can't store them, OR DON'T BUY THEIR CRAP.
I think you misunderstood what i said. They need the microphone to he listening but that microphone does not need to be recording every word you say in your home and sending it off to the manufacturer.
Tbh, they have smart things that would never occur to me. A distinctive warning in the box doesn't cost much. Is it ambitious? No, but it's easy and cheap and let's the consumer know.
Agreeing with Raphael Cruz?! It made my head spin! But I would also like to point out the part about internet-connected thermostats. This technology allows power companies to lower the strain on the electrical grid under certain circumstances to prevent brown and black outs. That makes a lot of sense, but it goes against the Texas "I got mine, screw you" attitude.
Smart thermostats will allow control by electric companies, and Amazon just shut down a guys’ smart home a couple weeks ago because a delivery driver thought he’s been insulted through the doorbell cam. It took days for Amazon to investigate and turn the guys’ devices back on.
I was thinking this had to be a tall tale, and I'm glad I can confirm this is a lie.
It was 1 month ago.
https://dailycaller.com/2023/06/14/amazon-confirms-shut-down-smart-home-false-racism-claims/
What was a lie? I’ve been busy and thought it was just a couple of weeks ago. My perception of time was off.
‘Amazon confirmed to the Daily Caller Wednesday they shut off a man’s smart home because one of their drivers claimed an automated doorbell said something racist.’
‘ In this case, we learned through our investigation that the customer did not act inappropriately, and we’re working directly with the customer to resolve their concerns while also looking at ways to prevent a similar situation from happening again”
I can count on one hand every internet-connected device in my house. Each can be turned off easily.
No Alexa. No Ring. Not even a smart TV. The latter actually saved me a huge chunk of change. Amazing how cheap a 65" 4k TV can be when it has no built-in apps.
200 + million people clambered as fast as they could give more of their information to "meta"
Not that I think they are doing anything bad with it, and I have no issues with advertising that is more tailored towards my needs.
What I do have issues with is companies like Cambridge analytica that know how to abuse the data Facebook gives them to manipulate people into doing bad things.
> 200 + million people clambered as fast as they could give more of their information to "meta"
“You don’t understand, my boyfriend has changed. He would never hurt me like before.”
Phone, Tablet other Google devices spying on me, perfectly okay. The Fucking Air Fryer spying on me, and conspiring with Toaster? ___That's___ where I draw the line.
During COVID when some people were saying the vaccine contained a microchip to spy on you, I was like dude, you already have a microchip that spies on you and you probably make sure it never leaves your side.
I know, right?? lmfao this is perfect, in one fell swoop we get to fuck over IoT shit so that manufacturers can't slip in phone home capabilities without letting us know their shit ass product does it.
I really didn't think that I would see eye to eye with Ted. But, why stop there?! This should include the dining room table, beanbag chair, and cordless toothbrush.
It doesn't have to sound dumb, this just is dumb.
If a person doesn't understand that an Alexa device needs a microphone, there's not much help for them.
And if a device doesn't need a microphone, and they put one in anyways, and use that data for anything at all - that's a breach of several consumer protection laws already.
This bill is big dumb.
I agree with the boomers that I don't need my appliances connected to the internet. I'm pretty sure my stove has wifi and an app but I feel zero need to set it up.
It's ok. You can agree with Ted Cruz once in a blue, quietly go weep through a bleach bath and steel wool scrub, and carry on with your day. No one will judge.
This is a terrible bill!!! Why would anyone care if we...err... those darn air fryers are spying on us or trying to have sex with your...errr....our wives??
Yeah I hate the guy, but just popped in to make sure people were commenting like this...
Replace 'air fryer' with any phone or alexa device and it's not silly and good to hear.
Except that it’s meaningless if we can’t opt out. Knowing you’re being spied on is useless if you can’t stop it. Now, someone with Teddy Kruise’s resources can create options, but most consumers are stuck with whatever the manufacturer-retailer cartel decides to stick them with.
Yeah, I don’t know any details of the law he’s proposing, but the goal is commendable. IoT and smart homes are already a thing, and both security and privacy issues need to be addressed by legislators.
Imagine having virtually all appliances voice controlled and connected to the internet and no laws regulating whether or not the appliances are allowed to ”collect data” without consent?
Or imagine having all your lights connected to the internet and controlled via an app, and one day all your lamps go dark and you get an email demanding $500 to give back control over them.
Even worse is when they're made out to sound like fools like this title. Sure, he might generally be wack but even the stupidest people have one or two decent ideas in their lives. I'm all for being notified when I'm being spied on by my Alexa or whatever
It is but "disclosure" is useless. We need to be able to monitor what data is passing through the device.
When I click "allow access to mic, or internet history" on some app, does that mean it's live streaming? I really don't know. And the granularity at which different apps and devices spy on you or just report necessary data is NOT encompassed by "allow access to." SOMEONE needs to actually monitor the level of invasion like the FDA and EPA used to -- but now they protect industry from lawsuits more than protect us.
So -- it's cool that Ted Cruz is talking about this, but knowing Ted Cruz, it's not actually going to protect us -- just pay lip service.
Agreed, but this isn't bad for a first step. Expose ALL "hidden" phoning home capabilities. Force manufacturers to disclose that, yes, their shit ass device phones home. They don't get to hide that shit anymore, no "may contact", no vagueness, no bullshit. They have to explicitly spell it out.
It's not useless. If people find out their desired appliance has a mic and internet capabilities that can record them even when not in use, they might think twice about buying that appliance. That's less sales for companies vs traditional appliances.
As an electrical engineer, I'm all for technology, but making everything "smart" is just plain stupid. Save the chips for what really matters, not a freaking washer that can use voice commands.
> It is but "disclosure" is useless.
No, it's not useless. It lets consumers know if something they are buying has a camera or microphone, which is the point. Does it address all data and privacy issues, no, but it is a good first step.
We don't just need to be able to monitor the data. The law should dictate that the device defaults to not collecting data at all, should not have any pre-checked boxes indicating consent to data collection, should spell out plainly what data is collected, how long it's kept, and whether it's sold or given to third parties, and allow users to see and delete all of their data that the company holds.
Ideally the law would dictate that this kind of data belongs to the user and not to the company and that it's unlawful to sell or retransmit the data without an explicit contract with the user, who must be fairly compensated for use of their data.
I don't see how disclosure is useful.
Anyone with a braincell would know that if a smart appliance can be controlled via voice then it has a microphone.
If a smart fridge has a camera to identify what product you have in your fridge then chances are the owner of the product would know it has a camera.
This. If it asks to connect to your wifi during setup, assume it can transmit data. If it listens for voice commands, assume it's listening to what you said.
While the law seems like a step in the right direction, it's one of those steps made by people who obviously have no clue what the next step should be. The bigger issue is what it does with the data, not that it needs to collect data to function.
This makes sense tbh and seems like proactive legislation. There already are smart fridges that can take pictures of the inside of the fridge, and can listen to voice commands. With the Internet of Things steadily growing, you could likely see this technology make its way into other devices as a way to keep track of cooking temperature or brownness of things like the thanksgiving turkey.
Yeah I hate the man with a passion but he's right here. I'll never buy a smart fridge and I disable every permission on my phone for mic and camera if I can. I know it doesn't stop everything but it's at least something.
It's insane how much data they collect.
This story is oniony, just because there is another source that presents the same facts in a less comical manor doesn't make this article less onion like.
He’s was also quite few years ago been one of the first non progressive candidates in house to really try to push for anti-lobbying and even agreed with aoc on that issue. Wish people wouldn’t just go with hate or like and just see issues for what they are and back certain policies no matter who
There Is no reason your airfryer should spy on you?
My light bulbs spy on us. In order to run the bulbs. I have to install an app on my phone that wants full access to my entire online life.
It sounds like a good start Ted!
Legislation is always a decade behind technology.
Weird the headline is so focused on the air fryer lol
He at least mentions WiFi light bulbs and smart fridges and smart thermostats being disabled, more relevant objects
Ya it’s probably good to have this in place. On the flip side though, when your air fryer asks for a wifi password that’s when you say “no thanks, you just fry French fries” I’ve got half a dozen smart TVs and none of them are connected to the internet. They don’t need the internet to work as a display for AppleTV or PlayStation.
Until they decided to brick the device until you connect it to the internet.
At that point i would just return it. "It's broken. I plugged it in, put fries in, and it said 'please connect me to the internet'. I didn't buy a computer i bought an air fryer."
I've got a bricked epson printer because of this.
Recycled cartriges are £14 but keep 'failing' and report dry almost immediately.
Originals are almost £50 but it looks like i may have to use them just to ensure it works.
My solution is to not buy printers. If you need to print documents regularly, get a decent black & white laser printer. If you print rarely, there are often commercial places that will print much nicer quality than your inkjet can do and charge on a per page basis. For offices, laser printers make much more sense. And most documents are transferred electronically nowadays anyway.
I bought a Brother CISS printer in 2020 or 2021, can't remember. Damn thing still has ink and refilling it is as easy as pouring ink in the tanks.
Why people buy Epson/HP products is beyond me.
Don't normally disagree but bought at start of covid as me and kids sent home with a million pdfs and nothing to write on. Printers were impossible to get for about a month in 2020.
Lasers do make more sense in office environment.
Edit Worth mentioning im an architect too so prints are often a godsend when needing to sketch.
You can buy ink refills then put a needle to fill up the cartridge. Orrrr but a eco tank. Had to fill it once after I printed a whole semester worth of papers.
The computer screen set up at the customer service department to take returns does not respond, refuses your refund, and tells you to "have a nice day" In a cheery digitized voice.
If i was malicious, i do it that way. Many stores have a 30 day or 60 day return policy. Wait 60 days and then lock up until connected to internet. That way they have to connect it as they can't return it.
On the flip side, if he read the article, this is about manufacturers of consumer electronics reporting microphones and cameras within any of their products to the consumer.
If you straw man the legislation into purely being about air fryers it is indeed very silly.
You have to register for a service to adjust the temperature and THEN you click a "accept terms" and THEN they spy on you. It's all nice an civilized.
/s
My brother in law bought an air fryer that you can set by turning the knob to adjust temp/time on the digital screen but also has an app he can use to just set the temp and time with and I don't think he remembers that he bought an IoT Air Fryer to go with the rest of his IoT everything.
I think it's also connected to their google home
Did he? This looks like a crappier version of the Consumer Protection Act - this doesn't mean they cannot sell those things, just that somewhere on the label they have to say a camera exists on it.
The Consumer Protection Act is already preventing this kind of thing from happening, that's why it's not happening.
>just that somewhere on the label they have to say a camera exists on it.
Well that's useless. They already bury "no responsibility" and "give us all your data" in every EULA we click through.
I think at least one court case exists where a judge basically ruled that things put in tbe tos and eulas cant be used against you (with reason) as its an unrealistic (read: almost impossible) expectation for a user to read and keep up to date on all such contracts they sign
Theres a chance im wrong or misrememvefing it. But i could have sworn that was a thing
I remember the same and I thought that was a sound and "consumer/citizen" oriented decision. However, we all know that we can't always depend on sound legal logic from judges when there are corporations to please.
So -- LOGICALLY, those contracts aren't binding because we have an expectation the product will function a certain way -- and just because we clicked a check on 24 pages of legalese -- they don't get to shirk their responsibility.
It's just that -- as you can see, we can't DEPEND on rational decisions.
The courts have basically killed the right to privacy by determining; "If you have no expectation of privacy, you do not have the right." So -- now that everyone expects to be screwed by products spying on them at all times -- well, we were warned, right?
So I can choose not to have any electronics, a phone and use the web or social media and keep a job in multimedia and marketing -- wow, so many choices and they all lead to me having no job or life!
Here's what's surreal about this: Ted Cruz making the news for something that isn't horrible: two times in a row! ([last time](https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/4037617-cruz-defends-criticism-of-ugandan-anti-gay-law-after-florida-pastors-pushback/))
Who are you, and what have you done with the real Ted Cruz?
As a European, following the US Republican party descent from (thinly veiled authoritarian) neoliberalism into complete anti-human resentful madness, has made me ponder if there is a limit. When do extreme right politicians *have* to start taking stances that are at least somewhat connected to reality?
The Republicans apparently have tried positioning themselves as the "workers' party" by appeasing to values and traditions, rather than the needs of the people. However, there has to be a point at which people realize that there are more pressing issues than drag shows or guns and tradition. Is this guy now trying to reposition himself by being right at least two times a day?
EDIT: The EU, while not always succeeding at privacy, has passed multiple laws which make it harder to spy on customers, upsetting US corporations. This proposal by Cruz is at its core pretty much in line with the EU law, even if it doesn't go as far. Anti-corporate "freedom", I guess, but a good start if it ever passes.
>The EU, while not always succeeding at privacy, has passed multiple laws which make it harder to spy on customers, upsetting US corporations
The EU prefers to be the only one spying on its citizens.
Just on those issues you listed, here’s how a conservative sees them: keeping a line between sexual activity and kids, a basic human right to self defense and a requirement to maintain a free society, and tradition (which I’m less sure what you mean by that) is about trying to keep a consistent American identity through our life and generations.
I’m not going to argue wether these are reasonable definitions of those issues or not, I’m just painting how conservatives think about and vote on it, after all, politicians are generally a rough reflection of the voter base
I mean, it basically comes down to requiring a warning label stating "device contains a microphone required for voice activation". Which I guess is a start, but it is a bit trivial. It's pretty obvious what spy features a device has. Voice, microphone. Network, wifi access. Visual identification, camera. It isn't like these products try to hide it. It's a feature they actively market in order to charge more.
This might be onion-y if written 10 years ago, but it's a real concern atm.
The most onion-y part of this is that Ted Cruz is proposing consumer protecting regulation instead of stripping it away.
I remember like a decade ago, this girl told me about how ridiculous her mom was for taping a little piece of paper over her laptops camera and I agreed at the hilarity of it.
Not quite so hilarious in retrospect.
I think he's not expecting anything to come of it to be honest. Even if it passes, too many devices would fall into it (rightfully) that most consumers would just dismiss the disclaimers as boilerplate.
It's not exceptional if "everything does it," after all.
In line with this post is the fact that many do not take seriously. If you have any devise, with a camera and mike, an on line connection may leave you open to snoopers.
First reported by the Daily Caller, Cruz took to the Senate floor on Tuesday to ask for support on the Informing Consumers about the Smart Devices Act which will require companies to notify customers of cameras and microphone in everyday appliances and devices.....
Is this some weird way of not supporting it by making an idiotic statement when there are plenty of devices and/or apps that spy on their users every sec of every day.
I have to say this is one of the worst headlines I have seen in a while. I don't believe it is partisan to say that a lot of companies are attempting to collect as much data as they can. And a bill trying to curtail that should not be shot in the foot simply because one dislikes the person presenting the bill. This is the sort of bill that should be seen as a bi-partisan win, not presented as "Ted Cruz is afraid and paranoid of his air fryer."
I mean, generally speaking that's not happening, but (and this makes my stomach churn a bit) he does have a good point that we need legislation in place to protect privacy and make sure it's not happening without anyone's knowledge (I'd go a step further and require devices to have an opt-in consent before enabling anything that sends data outside of the local network).
I'm no fan of the Cruze, but if you go past that headline, and read the meat:
>Cruz took to the Senate floor on Tuesday to ask for support on the Informing Consumers about the Smart Devices Act which will require companies to notify customers of cameras and microphone in everyday appliances and devices.
This... is welcomed by me. More devices are capable of enabling cams/mics than you probably are aware of. Not a horrible idea at all.
There's no legitimate reason to own any appliances that require a wi-fi connection. Or an Alexa for that matter. These devices only tack on additional costs that are not outweighed by the level of convenience they *might* offer. People need to be smart, not appliances.
Internet of things devices are notoriously unsecure. Security has lower priority than getting a product out quickly. Remember the recent news that Roku type software built into new TVs came with malware pre-installed.
Yeah, but more and more companies spying on you isn't good. Especially since these companies might have absolutely garbage privacy rules. I know Google has shit on me. LG and GE don't need to monitor me, too.
There are refrigerators with Amazon Alexa integration, and other smart appliances have been a thing for a while. Most of them require a user account and a network connection, and they almost certainly send usage data back home.
This is actually good.
"Informing Consumers about the Smart Devices Act which will require companies to notify customers of cameras and microphone in everyday appliances and devices."
That and how data recorded is used, and hopefully also that use (and sharing) beyond the function of the product should be illegal.
This is not very fair.
He mentioned Air Fryers among other things, but someon picked that specific appliance to make fun of a reasonable proposal.
There are many people, not only those in their 90s, who are not that well informed about how many devices there are which have microphones, and cameras inside of them, many people dont know that their remote control has a microphone, or that some smart Tvs have a camera.
Personally , i believe that it would be a good idea to have dedicated on/off buttons for such sensors.
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The daft thing is at £50 refill the inks as expensive as the device. So a makes the device practically disposable as its a great printer scanner copier otherwise
User: hey SmartToaster 5000, have you been spying on me these days?
SmartToaster5000: no sir
SmartToaster5000: also, I noticed you are spending 27% more time in the gym. Have you seen the latest deals on sports clothing? Amazon dot com!
It’s on all smart devices and the fact that there needs to be a law for it is crazy, devices should not be allowed to spy on you….even crazier he’s being made fun of for it…like where are the democrats on this?
Important shit right there. This is the legislation we need. This man is making it happen and his legacy will be secured for future wonderment of future generations for decades… 🙄
I.... agree with him?
If the bill passes can they call it Cruz Control?
NO! I mean yes, it's a great bit, but NO! We can't give him any credit!
Why can’t we give him credit if he does something right?
Right? I don’t personally agree with a lot of what he does but we can’t just lock people in boxes and make them evil forever.
We're not making Cruz evil. His doing that without any help from us.
I think giving him credit is fine, after he takes credit for all the horrible shut he's done.
* *angry screaming coming from a room shaped like an up arrow* *
This needs to be the top comment.
There definitely needs to be more regulation around smart devices, but this bill doesn't really seem to do an awful lot - now manufacturers will need to print "this device contains a microphone to support voice commands" but they can still save and send all those recordings to god knows where. Would be much better to have laws around data privacy instead, if anything this law is just a distraction.
It's kinda like our Proposition 65 carcinogen warning law in California. Good intent but without context, all that happened was lots of warning on lots of things since lots of chemicals are carcinogenic, without explanation of dosage, exposure, duration, accumulation, etc.
Yep, that hill juts made everything in California cancer causing to the point that people don’t care about the warning.
There's this story about a wolf...
Yea but if you read the label you'll know that shit is only known to cause cancer in the state of California. You'll be fine anywhere else *taps head*
I mean, that's basically how the majority of "this device spies on you" works. If it's networked or voice activated, it has to spy on you. That's part of how the feature works. If people are concerned about appliances spying on them, don't pay extra for one that has built in spy features.
I mean it is reasonable to want to buy an item with voice commands that doesn’t record every sound in your house so the company can sell every private conversation you have.
They already can't. This bill is doing fuck-all to stop any real problem. If a company wants to sell your data, you need to sign an EULA that releases that data, like FaceBook or Twitter has. If they were to record you, then sell that data without you signing anything that allows it, that's a clear breach of the Consumer Protection Act prohibiting deceptive business practiced through omission. Basically Cruz's bill will do literally nothing other than make products that obviously have listening devises in them say they do, which you have to be an actual neanderthal to not understand a device need a microphone to hear you.
> They already can't. [...] If a company wants to sell your data, you need to sign an EULA that releases that data That's a complex way to say "they actually can". There's a reason the EU made it illegal to claim consent with a clause buried in an EULA. EULAs are way too complex, to the point they have little legal power in contexts where *informed* consent is required.
What hes saying is that voice command features don't work without the spying, so no it's not reasonable to want them and not be spied on. Don't buy their product, it's not hard. For those who don't know, the way these voice commands work is it's always recording from a microphone. When it recognizes the simple activate command it saves the last 30 seconds or so of audio it recorded and sends it to a central server for processing to find out what you said and search up the response. If you don't want them keeping your conversations then force your politicians to write a law that they can't store them, OR DON'T BUY THEIR CRAP.
I think you misunderstood what i said. They need the microphone to he listening but that microphone does not need to be recording every word you say in your home and sending it off to the manufacturer.
Tbh, they have smart things that would never occur to me. A distinctive warning in the box doesn't cost much. Is it ambitious? No, but it's easy and cheap and let's the consumer know.
Agreeing with Raphael Cruz?! It made my head spin! But I would also like to point out the part about internet-connected thermostats. This technology allows power companies to lower the strain on the electrical grid under certain circumstances to prevent brown and black outs. That makes a lot of sense, but it goes against the Texas "I got mine, screw you" attitude.
I don’t think people realise how many things in everyday life are collecting their data and selling it.
Smart thermostats will allow control by electric companies, and Amazon just shut down a guys’ smart home a couple weeks ago because a delivery driver thought he’s been insulted through the doorbell cam. It took days for Amazon to investigate and turn the guys’ devices back on.
Not only was a guys smart home shut down for possible thoughtcrime, a reporters smart home was shut down for reporting on it.
Really! I didn’t know that!
I was thinking this had to be a tall tale, and I'm glad I can confirm this is a lie. It was 1 month ago. https://dailycaller.com/2023/06/14/amazon-confirms-shut-down-smart-home-false-racism-claims/
What was a lie? I’ve been busy and thought it was just a couple of weeks ago. My perception of time was off. ‘Amazon confirmed to the Daily Caller Wednesday they shut off a man’s smart home because one of their drivers claimed an automated doorbell said something racist.’ ‘ In this case, we learned through our investigation that the customer did not act inappropriately, and we’re working directly with the customer to resolve their concerns while also looking at ways to prevent a similar situation from happening again”
The comment you are responding to was probably sarcastic—the “lie” is that it happened a month ago rather than “just happened”… I think anyway
Ah. It as late at night in my time zone and I wasn’t on my toes. :)
Do you read your own links?
I can count on one hand every internet-connected device in my house. Each can be turned off easily. No Alexa. No Ring. Not even a smart TV. The latter actually saved me a huge chunk of change. Amazing how cheap a 65" 4k TV can be when it has no built-in apps.
Panaphonics makes a 65" 4k TV?
Naw, it's a Sorny. For real though, it's made by Sceptre, and has incredible picture quality. Shitty speakers, but I already had a soundbar.
I prefer my Samsong.
200 + million people clambered as fast as they could give more of their information to "meta" Not that I think they are doing anything bad with it, and I have no issues with advertising that is more tailored towards my needs. What I do have issues with is companies like Cambridge analytica that know how to abuse the data Facebook gives them to manipulate people into doing bad things.
> 200 + million people clambered as fast as they could give more of their information to "meta" “You don’t understand, my boyfriend has changed. He would never hurt me like before.”
Phone, Tablet other Google devices spying on me, perfectly okay. The Fucking Air Fryer spying on me, and conspiring with Toaster? ___That's___ where I draw the line.
I never trusted Toaster.
Not even when he was Little and Brave?
I was hoping to see a Brave Little Toaster reference in this comment thread. I was not disappointed
Brave, Little ^deep ^state Toaster.
This comment made me laugh, it made my girlfriend laugh, it made the toaster laugh, we shot the toaster.
Exactly!!! I dont own an air fryer, but if i did, AND it was spying on me... id like to know..
My God… if they turned on us…
During COVID when some people were saying the vaccine contained a microchip to spy on you, I was like dude, you already have a microchip that spies on you and you probably make sure it never leaves your side.
I know, right?? lmfao this is perfect, in one fell swoop we get to fuck over IoT shit so that manufacturers can't slip in phone home capabilities without letting us know their shit ass product does it.
I really didn't think that I would see eye to eye with Ted. But, why stop there?! This should include the dining room table, beanbag chair, and cordless toothbrush.
Pretty sure it does. Air fryer is just a catchier headline because it makes it sound dumb.
It doesn't have to sound dumb, this just is dumb. If a person doesn't understand that an Alexa device needs a microphone, there's not much help for them. And if a device doesn't need a microphone, and they put one in anyways, and use that data for anything at all - that's a breach of several consumer protection laws already. This bill is big dumb.
Yeah this headline is fkin stupid (like I'm surprised?).But remember, politics is a team sort so anything the other team says or does is pure evil!
This opportunity comes but once in a lifetime.
I mean all appliances right?
Broken clock is still right twice a day :(
Aside from the myriad of awful stuff, he does push for some good laws. He tried to get loot boxes banned at some point, too.
a man from the party (which claims to be) of small government attempting to ban loot boxes from video games is equal parts hilarious and absurd
Never trust someone who tells you your air fryer *is definitely not* spying on you
I agree with the boomers that I don't need my appliances connected to the internet. I'm pretty sure my stove has wifi and an app but I feel zero need to set it up.
"we need a class action against all machines!"
It's ok. You can agree with Ted Cruz once in a blue, quietly go weep through a bleach bath and steel wool scrub, and carry on with your day. No one will judge.
Yeah, I mean - whatever you think of Ted Cruz, this is a real thing and regulation is probably needed.
This....this cannot be....
This is an extremely slanted and disingenuous headline. As much as I dislike the Tedster, this issue is worth considering.
Totally agree. Don’t like the guy, but we gotta band together to expose all the air fryer spyers.
Today we expose the air fryers, and tomorrow the coffee makers!!
Or you know, pass a law to ban decepticons?
This is a terrible bill!!! Why would anyone care if we...err... those darn air fryers are spying on us or trying to have sex with your...errr....our wives??
Why not, just, you know.... Ban spying?
Yeah I hate the guy, but just popped in to make sure people were commenting like this... Replace 'air fryer' with any phone or alexa device and it's not silly and good to hear.
Except that it’s meaningless if we can’t opt out. Knowing you’re being spied on is useless if you can’t stop it. Now, someone with Teddy Kruise’s resources can create options, but most consumers are stuck with whatever the manufacturer-retailer cartel decides to stick them with.
Yeah, I don’t know any details of the law he’s proposing, but the goal is commendable. IoT and smart homes are already a thing, and both security and privacy issues need to be addressed by legislators. Imagine having virtually all appliances voice controlled and connected to the internet and no laws regulating whether or not the appliances are allowed to ”collect data” without consent? Or imagine having all your lights connected to the internet and controlled via an app, and one day all your lamps go dark and you get an email demanding $500 to give back control over them.
Always annoying when terrible people make good points.
Even worse is when they're made out to sound like fools like this title. Sure, he might generally be wack but even the stupidest people have one or two decent ideas in their lives. I'm all for being notified when I'm being spied on by my Alexa or whatever
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Seriously -- I loathe the guy, but disclosure of these devices is absolutely the right thing.
It is but "disclosure" is useless. We need to be able to monitor what data is passing through the device. When I click "allow access to mic, or internet history" on some app, does that mean it's live streaming? I really don't know. And the granularity at which different apps and devices spy on you or just report necessary data is NOT encompassed by "allow access to." SOMEONE needs to actually monitor the level of invasion like the FDA and EPA used to -- but now they protect industry from lawsuits more than protect us. So -- it's cool that Ted Cruz is talking about this, but knowing Ted Cruz, it's not actually going to protect us -- just pay lip service.
It would be nice to see the data that is collected on me from my various devices.
I've seen it, you dirty dirty person.
Fuck, it would be nice to be paid for all the data they're taking and selling.
Agreed, but this isn't bad for a first step. Expose ALL "hidden" phoning home capabilities. Force manufacturers to disclose that, yes, their shit ass device phones home. They don't get to hide that shit anymore, no "may contact", no vagueness, no bullshit. They have to explicitly spell it out.
It's not useless. If people find out their desired appliance has a mic and internet capabilities that can record them even when not in use, they might think twice about buying that appliance. That's less sales for companies vs traditional appliances. As an electrical engineer, I'm all for technology, but making everything "smart" is just plain stupid. Save the chips for what really matters, not a freaking washer that can use voice commands.
> It is but "disclosure" is useless. No, it's not useless. It lets consumers know if something they are buying has a camera or microphone, which is the point. Does it address all data and privacy issues, no, but it is a good first step.
We don't just need to be able to monitor the data. The law should dictate that the device defaults to not collecting data at all, should not have any pre-checked boxes indicating consent to data collection, should spell out plainly what data is collected, how long it's kept, and whether it's sold or given to third parties, and allow users to see and delete all of their data that the company holds. Ideally the law would dictate that this kind of data belongs to the user and not to the company and that it's unlawful to sell or retransmit the data without an explicit contract with the user, who must be fairly compensated for use of their data.
I don't see how disclosure is useful. Anyone with a braincell would know that if a smart appliance can be controlled via voice then it has a microphone. If a smart fridge has a camera to identify what product you have in your fridge then chances are the owner of the product would know it has a camera.
This. If it asks to connect to your wifi during setup, assume it can transmit data. If it listens for voice commands, assume it's listening to what you said. While the law seems like a step in the right direction, it's one of those steps made by people who obviously have no clue what the next step should be. The bigger issue is what it does with the data, not that it needs to collect data to function.
That seems completely reasonable.
OP definitely didn't get the reaction he wanted from this post.
Still got the upvotes
Should probably have posted this on r/politics with the other poorly worded titles
This makes sense tbh and seems like proactive legislation. There already are smart fridges that can take pictures of the inside of the fridge, and can listen to voice commands. With the Internet of Things steadily growing, you could likely see this technology make its way into other devices as a way to keep track of cooking temperature or brownness of things like the thanksgiving turkey.
Yeah I hate the man with a passion but he's right here. I'll never buy a smart fridge and I disable every permission on my phone for mic and camera if I can. I know it doesn't stop everything but it's at least something. It's insane how much data they collect.
This story is oniony, just because there is another source that presents the same facts in a less comical manor doesn't make this article less onion like.
I love how even with manual approval and a dead sub, the little that leaks through is still not oniony. This sub is shit and needs to die.
The onion part is the deliberately misleading title on the post.
He’s was also quite few years ago been one of the first non progressive candidates in house to really try to push for anti-lobbying and even agreed with aoc on that issue. Wish people wouldn’t just go with hate or like and just see issues for what they are and back certain policies no matter who
I would have guessed that this was a California thing if nobody said who sponsored it. Surprised Pikachu!
The oniony part is that he's actually standing up for the ordinary consumer.
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The headline is oniony. This sub isn't for reading articles.
tragic: the worst person you know just made a great point
I mean he’s partnered with a democrat so it’s not only him
There Is no reason your airfryer should spy on you? My light bulbs spy on us. In order to run the bulbs. I have to install an app on my phone that wants full access to my entire online life. It sounds like a good start Ted! Legislation is always a decade behind technology.
Weird the headline is so focused on the air fryer lol He at least mentions WiFi light bulbs and smart fridges and smart thermostats being disabled, more relevant objects
The headline is blatantly trying to make him look dumb and bad
Heartbreaking, the worst man you know made a good point.
Ya it’s probably good to have this in place. On the flip side though, when your air fryer asks for a wifi password that’s when you say “no thanks, you just fry French fries” I’ve got half a dozen smart TVs and none of them are connected to the internet. They don’t need the internet to work as a display for AppleTV or PlayStation.
Until they decided to brick the device until you connect it to the internet. At that point i would just return it. "It's broken. I plugged it in, put fries in, and it said 'please connect me to the internet'. I didn't buy a computer i bought an air fryer."
The printer-scanner scam. No printer ink, no scanning for you, mister!
[https://imgur.io/gallery/eMJpp1G](https://imgur.io/gallery/eMJpp1G)
I've got a bricked epson printer because of this. Recycled cartriges are £14 but keep 'failing' and report dry almost immediately. Originals are almost £50 but it looks like i may have to use them just to ensure it works.
My solution is to not buy printers. If you need to print documents regularly, get a decent black & white laser printer. If you print rarely, there are often commercial places that will print much nicer quality than your inkjet can do and charge on a per page basis. For offices, laser printers make much more sense. And most documents are transferred electronically nowadays anyway.
I bought a Brother CISS printer in 2020 or 2021, can't remember. Damn thing still has ink and refilling it is as easy as pouring ink in the tanks. Why people buy Epson/HP products is beyond me.
Don't normally disagree but bought at start of covid as me and kids sent home with a million pdfs and nothing to write on. Printers were impossible to get for about a month in 2020. Lasers do make more sense in office environment. Edit Worth mentioning im an architect too so prints are often a godsend when needing to sketch.
You can buy ink refills then put a needle to fill up the cartridge. Orrrr but a eco tank. Had to fill it once after I printed a whole semester worth of papers.
Can you use an ecotank in an xp3300?
No internet? No scanner! -HP
I do like the can to dropbox option on my epson. But can wire it up if needed.
The computer screen set up at the customer service department to take returns does not respond, refuses your refund, and tells you to "have a nice day" In a cheery digitized voice.
Just go the boomer route and scream "REPRESENTATIVE!" at it.
Hey I’m a millennial and I do that to phone trees….
Gen X here, I do not fuck around with phone trees.
The ones that are all like “I don’t know what you’re asking for…GOODBYE!” Drive me into a fit of rage
Would probably save you some time if you researched which air fryers require internet connection beforehand.
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Probably code it that if not connected by a certain date to check for updates it will refuse to run until it's connected.
If i was malicious, i do it that way. Many stores have a 30 day or 60 day return policy. Wait 60 days and then lock up until connected to internet. That way they have to connect it as they can't return it.
On the flip side, if he read the article, this is about manufacturers of consumer electronics reporting microphones and cameras within any of their products to the consumer. If you straw man the legislation into purely being about air fryers it is indeed very silly.
You have to register for a service to adjust the temperature and THEN you click a "accept terms" and THEN they spy on you. It's all nice an civilized. /s
I saw a thing on here a while back about a smart tv that wouldn't enable the HDMI ports until you put it online and let it phone home.
What the actual F. That’s when you realize they still own your tv.
Not to mention that having another thing that takes Wi-Fi in the house only serves to clog things up and make your Wi-Fi worse over time
My brother in law bought an air fryer that you can set by turning the knob to adjust temp/time on the digital screen but also has an app he can use to just set the temp and time with and I don't think he remembers that he bought an IoT Air Fryer to go with the rest of his IoT everything. I think it's also connected to their google home
Did he? This looks like a crappier version of the Consumer Protection Act - this doesn't mean they cannot sell those things, just that somewhere on the label they have to say a camera exists on it. The Consumer Protection Act is already preventing this kind of thing from happening, that's why it's not happening.
>just that somewhere on the label they have to say a camera exists on it. Well that's useless. They already bury "no responsibility" and "give us all your data" in every EULA we click through.
I think at least one court case exists where a judge basically ruled that things put in tbe tos and eulas cant be used against you (with reason) as its an unrealistic (read: almost impossible) expectation for a user to read and keep up to date on all such contracts they sign Theres a chance im wrong or misrememvefing it. But i could have sworn that was a thing
I remember the same and I thought that was a sound and "consumer/citizen" oriented decision. However, we all know that we can't always depend on sound legal logic from judges when there are corporations to please. So -- LOGICALLY, those contracts aren't binding because we have an expectation the product will function a certain way -- and just because we clicked a check on 24 pages of legalese -- they don't get to shirk their responsibility. It's just that -- as you can see, we can't DEPEND on rational decisions. The courts have basically killed the right to privacy by determining; "If you have no expectation of privacy, you do not have the right." So -- now that everyone expects to be screwed by products spying on them at all times -- well, we were warned, right? So I can choose not to have any electronics, a phone and use the web or social media and keep a job in multimedia and marketing -- wow, so many choices and they all lead to me having no job or life!
Here's what's surreal about this: Ted Cruz making the news for something that isn't horrible: two times in a row! ([last time](https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/4037617-cruz-defends-criticism-of-ugandan-anti-gay-law-after-florida-pastors-pushback/)) Who are you, and what have you done with the real Ted Cruz?
The other lizard man wasn’t likable enough so the swapped him out with their Jewish space teleporters.
Maybe he finally transitioned to his human form.
As a European, following the US Republican party descent from (thinly veiled authoritarian) neoliberalism into complete anti-human resentful madness, has made me ponder if there is a limit. When do extreme right politicians *have* to start taking stances that are at least somewhat connected to reality? The Republicans apparently have tried positioning themselves as the "workers' party" by appeasing to values and traditions, rather than the needs of the people. However, there has to be a point at which people realize that there are more pressing issues than drag shows or guns and tradition. Is this guy now trying to reposition himself by being right at least two times a day? EDIT: The EU, while not always succeeding at privacy, has passed multiple laws which make it harder to spy on customers, upsetting US corporations. This proposal by Cruz is at its core pretty much in line with the EU law, even if it doesn't go as far. Anti-corporate "freedom", I guess, but a good start if it ever passes.
>The EU, while not always succeeding at privacy, has passed multiple laws which make it harder to spy on customers, upsetting US corporations The EU prefers to be the only one spying on its citizens.
That's still less net spying though. The US got more corporate spying and still has the state spying on its citizens.
Just on those issues you listed, here’s how a conservative sees them: keeping a line between sexual activity and kids, a basic human right to self defense and a requirement to maintain a free society, and tradition (which I’m less sure what you mean by that) is about trying to keep a consistent American identity through our life and generations. I’m not going to argue wether these are reasonable definitions of those issues or not, I’m just painting how conservatives think about and vote on it, after all, politicians are generally a rough reflection of the voter base
This is a bull that impacts businesses. The only reason this is coming up, is because it’s unlikely to go anywhere.
It’s the beard. His patchy “Fat Wolverine” beard has been gradually humanizing him.
Love how they try to minimize this to the trivialities just because it came from Ted Cruz. Regulation on IOT is desperately needed
I mean, it basically comes down to requiring a warning label stating "device contains a microphone required for voice activation". Which I guess is a start, but it is a bit trivial. It's pretty obvious what spy features a device has. Voice, microphone. Network, wifi access. Visual identification, camera. It isn't like these products try to hide it. It's a feature they actively market in order to charge more.
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This might be onion-y if written 10 years ago, but it's a real concern atm. The most onion-y part of this is that Ted Cruz is proposing consumer protecting regulation instead of stripping it away.
I remember like a decade ago, this girl told me about how ridiculous her mom was for taping a little piece of paper over her laptops camera and I agreed at the hilarity of it. Not quite so hilarious in retrospect.
I think he's not expecting anything to come of it to be honest. Even if it passes, too many devices would fall into it (rightfully) that most consumers would just dismiss the disclaimers as boilerplate. It's not exceptional if "everything does it," after all.
What a dishonest, stupid headline.
In line with this post is the fact that many do not take seriously. If you have any devise, with a camera and mike, an on line connection may leave you open to snoopers.
First reported by the Daily Caller, Cruz took to the Senate floor on Tuesday to ask for support on the Informing Consumers about the Smart Devices Act which will require companies to notify customers of cameras and microphone in everyday appliances and devices..... Is this some weird way of not supporting it by making an idiotic statement when there are plenty of devices and/or apps that spy on their users every sec of every day.
This title is everything wrong with the right/left media and our political climate. They don’t report news, they try to influence. It’s old and tired
Everyone should support this… this isn’t a partisan issue. Mediaite isn’t on our side.
This is not a “good” idea it is something inherently good and should be a thing. Its like congratulating the first guy who outlawed murder.
I have to say this is one of the worst headlines I have seen in a while. I don't believe it is partisan to say that a lot of companies are attempting to collect as much data as they can. And a bill trying to curtail that should not be shot in the foot simply because one dislikes the person presenting the bill. This is the sort of bill that should be seen as a bi-partisan win, not presented as "Ted Cruz is afraid and paranoid of his air fryer."
Is... the joke that we already are ok with our devices spying on us?
Even I can’t argue with that. But go after Alexa, my ninja air fryer is cool.
I mean, generally speaking that's not happening, but (and this makes my stomach churn a bit) he does have a good point that we need legislation in place to protect privacy and make sure it's not happening without anyone's knowledge (I'd go a step further and require devices to have an opt-in consent before enabling anything that sends data outside of the local network).
If someone has to legislate it, it’s probably happening way more than you think
Generally speaking, it's very much happening...just not with an air fryer.
>.just not with an air fryer. yet
Your air fryer connects to the internet?
A broken clock can be right twice a day.
I'm no fan of the Cruze, but if you go past that headline, and read the meat: >Cruz took to the Senate floor on Tuesday to ask for support on the Informing Consumers about the Smart Devices Act which will require companies to notify customers of cameras and microphone in everyday appliances and devices. This... is welcomed by me. More devices are capable of enabling cams/mics than you probably are aware of. Not a horrible idea at all.
I agree with Ted Cruz. If your Air Fryer is spying on you, you should know about it.
There's no legitimate reason to own any appliances that require a wi-fi connection. Or an Alexa for that matter. These devices only tack on additional costs that are not outweighed by the level of convenience they *might* offer. People need to be smart, not appliances.
I mean, after reading the article, he makes a good point.
Internet of things devices are notoriously unsecure. Security has lower priority than getting a product out quickly. Remember the recent news that Roku type software built into new TVs came with malware pre-installed.
Click bait title, legit policy...it seems.
Your phone and most other devices are already spying on you, especially if you have a Dot or something similar.
Yeah, but more and more companies spying on you isn't good. Especially since these companies might have absolutely garbage privacy rules. I know Google has shit on me. LG and GE don't need to monitor me, too.
Not just spying in realtime, but opening up access to your network and anything sensitive you might have stored on it for hackers.
I mean, he's right about this. Broken clocks etc.
There are refrigerators with Amazon Alexa integration, and other smart appliances have been a thing for a while. Most of them require a user account and a network connection, and they almost certainly send usage data back home.
This is actually good. "Informing Consumers about the Smart Devices Act which will require companies to notify customers of cameras and microphone in everyday appliances and devices." That and how data recorded is used, and hopefully also that use (and sharing) beyond the function of the product should be illegal.
Honestly, broken clock moment here. We should know what information smart appliances are gathering.
Cruz is a tool, but this is bi-partisan legislation that actually is good.
The internet of things really is a privacy threat... And so is Ted Cruz
I trust my air fryer, but that microwave is a sneaky bastard.
When the worst person you know makes a good point.
This is not very fair. He mentioned Air Fryers among other things, but someon picked that specific appliance to make fun of a reasonable proposal. There are many people, not only those in their 90s, who are not that well informed about how many devices there are which have microphones, and cameras inside of them, many people dont know that their remote control has a microphone, or that some smart Tvs have a camera. Personally , i believe that it would be a good idea to have dedicated on/off buttons for such sensors.
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I mean, sure, why the fuck not
Even a broken clock is right at least twice a day (once if you're using 24hr)
The daft thing is at £50 refill the inks as expensive as the device. So a makes the device practically disposable as its a great printer scanner copier otherwise
100% agree with Cruz on this one, companies spying on citizens (especially foreign companies) is a pretty scary prospect.
User: hey SmartToaster 5000, have you been spying on me these days? SmartToaster5000: no sir SmartToaster5000: also, I noticed you are spending 27% more time in the gym. Have you seen the latest deals on sports clothing? Amazon dot com!
It’s on all smart devices and the fact that there needs to be a law for it is crazy, devices should not be allowed to spy on you….even crazier he’s being made fun of for it…like where are the democrats on this?
I’m more worried about the vacuum cleaner, that things been gathering dirt on me for years.
Important shit right there. This is the legislation we need. This man is making it happen and his legacy will be secured for future wonderment of future generations for decades… 🙄
Good. I often ask Alexa if any of my appliances are spying on me and I never get a straight answer.
Headlines trash. But the meat makes sense. People should know if they have any appliance that can be connected to wifi
Yes, I would like to know if my Air Fryer is recording me. The toaster too. It's sketchy AF...