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The media portrays it's only for Kamala, but in context Adam is just saying Biden has to win overwhelmingly or pass it off, which in either case is obvious..however the media is misleading the public. -how is that not misinformation and destroy the reporters and it's companies credibility?
This is the same media actively helping a convicted felon and likely pedophile by complaining about Bidens age. The same ones ignoring the Epstein docs. They are not a friend of democracy.
4th estate essentially elected Trump and created this monster. Without media he would be just a wacko. Now his every utterance is front page news from both liberal and conservative news outlets.
“BREAKING: Leaked video shows Trump on his knees performing fellatio on President Vladimir Putin of Russia. Here’s why this is the final nail in the coffin for Biden.
Yup, I definitely recall them keeping their cameras on an empty fuckin podium waiting for candidate Trump to make a statement. Meanwhile other candidates were already at events speaking.
Noticed this morning the Washington Post had 11 articles about the dire condition of the Biden campaign and exactly one article about Trump. I haven't seen any articles on Project 25 and what it is. Connections between Project 25 and Trump and not a word about the Epstein dump.
Let’s not forget it was part of the Hillary 2016 campaign strategy to elevate trump in the primary because they thought he’d be easiest to beat in the general. Lots of blame to go around here.
Its because theres no news in printing thing like “Trumps a liar!” because everyone knows it, and none of his followers care. But to print “Bidens too old, did you see that debate?!” causes fear and anxiety and thats good for the media.
It’s pretty sad that they still manipulate the masses, but thats how it goes I guess.
I will never get tired of pointing out an old, rapey, racist, fascist felon is trying to run for president. How is turning Ridiculous to 11 considered a valid strategy?
>**I think she (Harris) very well could win overwhelmingly**, but before we get into a decision about who else it should be, the president needs to make a decision about whether it's him
Shift also very clearly said that Harris could win overwhelmingly. The article title isn’t misleading, it’s quoting a different quote then the one above.
Yeah but it’s more fun to read half an article, run back to Reddit to post some anti-media thing that will get upvoted to the top comment by people who didn’t read any of it.
"I think she (Harris) very well could win overwhelmingly, but before we get into a decision about who else it should be, the president needs to make a decision about whether it's him," Schiff told NBC News on Sunday.
——
How is *your* post not misinformation to destroy the reporter’s and Reuter’s credibility? It’s like the third paragraph in the article.
I think the media has decided the storyline this season involves Biden dropping out late in the race, in either case in the hopes Trump will win as he's good for clicks. Its why they couldn't leave him alone for four years and kept platforming him.
Showing the party has a backbone would go a long way to securing a vote. Due to the new ruling he could legally get rid of 3 SCOTUS judges, judge Cannon, and Trump party candidate Donald J Trump LEGALLY, 4/5 before the SCOTUS ruling. Americans deserve to have atleast 1 party in the government who will defend the constitution.
>He should be mopping the floor with Donald Trump. Joe Biden is running against a criminial. It should not be even close, and there's only one reason it is close, and that's the President's age.
>What I would advise the President is, seek out the opinions of people you trust. He's obviously talked to his family about this and that's important but he should seek out people with some distance and objectivity. He should seek out pollsters who are not his own pollsters.
Wow, this is pretty huge. No real way to spin that.
e: [Here's](https://youtu.be/xx-cvDy6p-8?si=Efdy6PS2iTAcMlrv) the full interview.
Because age is the worst thing Biden has going for him. He also is acting older than he has before.
Trump has way worse shit to talk about so age is the least of his problems, because he has so many. He also acts relatively younger when he speaks, so it’s held against him less.
What sucks is that Trump has moments where he’s speaking incoherently. Like his words (or often times his tweets) make no logical sense, but he says them with energy, so people just overlook it.
Biden sounds tired, but what he’s saying is actually coherent most of the time.
>He also acts relatively younger when he speaks, so it’s held against him less.
I disagree with this. The content of what trump says is waaaay worse than what Biden says. Trump says literal word salads of dog whistles and sound bites. It's just that he's louder.
Trump's posture when he speaks is more animated, sure, but it's still the movements of an old has-been used car salesman.
Agreed that the only thing Biden can be criticized for is his age, and, yes, Trump should be criticized for his age, too. As well as Trump's abysmal record and history.
Here in a red state, I was screaming that I voted for Leslie Knope aka the nerd who had a plan for everything… meanwhile my parents in a blue state voted for the bully. (They have since stated their deep regret for being part of the problem, voted for Biden and will do so again.)
But yeah. Your point stands, just less absolute than red v blue.
I am still saddened that my late father became a Trump supporter before he passed. We watched the 2016 GOP convention and I was fact-checking Trump in real time, he got really agitated by that. His last vote was for Trump, but my only solace was because of our stupid electoral college system and his living in a blue state, that his vote didn't actually "count".
Look, I can't stand Trump and I agree that the content of what he says is bonkers and incoherent. But he's got quick answers and one liners. He's animated when he talks. His line "I don't know what he said at the end of his last sentence. I don't think he knows, either" was devastating. Biden just stood there with his mouth agape, looking like he wasn't sure if he was at a debate, or if he was waiting for visiting hours to start at the nursing home.
Biden went into a debate where he knew his age was the biggest issue. The fact that he did even worse than anyone thought possible was a horrible sign. How bad would it have gotten if he hadn't been making an effort to (wildly unsuccessfully) combat the perception that he's not up to the task. Biden is 81 but could easily pass for 91. He's frail and feeble, except in the most controlled environments.
But this actually highlights an even bigger problem for Democrats: they simply don't give a shit what the electorate thinks. They've decided that people shouldn't care about his age, so they've tried just waving away and dismissing those concerns. They've decided that the one issue everyone should care about is the preservation of democracy. That's my top issue, but it's not the top issue for the vast vast majority of voters. But, that's what they've decided people SHOULD care about, so that's what the campaign is about. It's not so much a campaign asking for votes as it is a lecture tour.
If Biden stays in, I'm voting for him and begging everyone I know to do the same. But as Democrats, we have got to stop pretending that issues don't exist because it's not what the professional political class cares about. I pray that something happens that removes Trump as a candidate. But I'm the event my prayers aren't answered, we need to do a hell of a lot better than this.
The problem is that Trump has basically normalized his behavior, and the media has largely accepted it. You can no longer criticize his word salads because everyone just goes “well Trump’s gonna Trump, what can you do?”. It’s infuriating
I'm of the opinion that many Americans are really dumb, as seen in the 2016 election. Loud and unapologetic plays really well with that group, and the lies don't register with them. It really doesn't matter what he says, it's how he says it.
Smart voters don't fall for his shtick.
> Trump has always talked that way
Trump was fairly articulate back in the 90s. It's just that his drop off has been longer and more gradual.
[Here he is on Oprah in the 90s saying the exact same things he says today](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEPs17_AkTI).
He sounds exactly the same, honestly. He's only slightly more articulate in that video than he is today. Which is to say, even in this video, he speaks in bumbling generalities.
No one is comparing the content of the speech, just the body language and energy. Joe could barely get a sentence out that made sense. He kept tripping over his words and you could barely hear the guy. Anyone being honest can see that Trump and Biden are not aging the same. Biden is foggy, he’s slow, hes tired. And he should be, because he’s fucking 81 and that’s normal. But the wolf of fascism is here, sniffing under the door, and I just don’t think a tired old man is the right choice to defend us. We need a newsom or a whitmer or an AOC. Someone who not only gives a fuck about this country but is educated, witty and intelligent. Hell, put Jon Stewart up there and watch him mop the floor with Trump.
Did you watch the debate? Trump is a bit slower than previous campaigns but not by a huge margin. He just seems a lot younger. If Biden had the quickness of a decade ago no ody would talk about his age either.
Because Biden is showing the effects of age. Anthony Fauci is 2 years *older* than Biden and the man is still sharp as a whip. Age has caught up with Joe in a way it hasn’t with other people his age. Whether that’s a more serious health concern or weather that’s just age and stress, it’s hard to say, but it’s not *just* a number. He’s foggy, he’s tired, he’s tripping over his words, he’s asking governors for more time asleep at night. Meanwhile Trump is rage tweeting on the toilet at 3am and ran circles around Biden (even if his pants were on fire the entire time).
That’s why.
Exactly. I hate to say it, but humans are as dumb as dogs. We don't care what you say, as long as you say it the way we like.
"I hate your face" to my dog or my buddy is the same, say it happy, they're happy. Say it angry, they feel bad.
Doesn't matter that what Trump said was bullshit and bad faith, he said it in a way that wags the average voters tail. We're fucked.
I'll repeat what's been said a thousand times already, but it's because age has caught up with Biden much faster.
Here's 2020 debates. Trump is a little slower now. Biden is **much** slower now.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wW1lY5jFNcQ
I'm convinced there are a lot of people on the Democrat's side who were activated by Trump and have very little political memory of the time before him. I had the same conversation with 3 different well meaning, #resistance type people about Ginsburg on Twitter years back where they were adamant that people who suggested she should have resigned are idiots that have no concept of how things work bc we all know the Republicans never ever, not once, allowed Obama to put someone on the Supreme Court. When kagan and Sotomayora are brought up, they seem unaware of them. One person actually told me they didn't realize he had put 2 justices on the court prior to the GOP controlling the Senate. They mean well but just don't really remember much from 2015 back, probably bc they weren't political. The same people often say Bush wasnt that bad, that points to them not really paying attention bc Bush basically laid the groundwork for every bad thing Trump did
These people definitely don't remember that debate and seem to have an outsized voice on social media
> The same people often say Bush wasnt that bad, that points to them not really paying attention bc Bush basically laid the groundwork for every bad thing Trump did
Tbh I feel like that’s because a lot of resistance libs are more focused on Trump’s behavior and not really so much his policies. The way people have tried to redeem George W Bush is sickening to me, the dude was even worse than Trump when it came to foreign policy and helped crash our economy in 08. George W Bush is a monster, and so is Donald Trump.
Nothing works against trump because he has a rabid following of people voting and supporting based on a cocktail of precieved grievances, conspiracy theories, insecurities, disaffection, and victim complexes
He is the panacea for every ill they believe the society to have.
Also, this race is the difference between a well-spoken lie and a stuttered truth.
Because trump doesnt look like a vegetable as much as Joe Biden. Criminal or not - if you think they both showed the same level of «foot in the grave» you are not being objective. Coming from someone outside the US.
Where were these concerns a year ago?
Establishment Dems are the absolute worst they put us in this position and now want to self sabotage so they can hedge and pretend they “knew better” if Biden despite Biden being their candidate
If they have to ride him until November it needs to be done and everyone needs to show up and vote. However, win or lose its way past time Dem leadership take all the criticism and all the accountability and not just let them shut down any discussion as "pro-Trump/russian propaganda" or throw progressive voters under the bus.
> Establishment Dems are the absolute worst they put us in this position
Yep. They had 8 fucking years to prepare for this moment. And the result? A frail old guy who doesn't know where he is half of the time. That's what they come up with to go against Trump. lol
This take is so bad. “It should not be close”, it shouldn’t have in 2016 either. Should have been even better in 2020. I don’t know why people all of a sudden are pretending it’s easy to run against Trump. Have we not learned the past 2 elections that a good portion of voters don’t actually care about the lies and crap Trump says?
Apparently not learned much of why people vote for Trump at all through 3 election cycles. Since it looks like a close race again. Just endless focusing on the wrong things.
Trump is actually a strong candidate even if we are reviled by him.
If we are making decisions about how to beat him let's actually frame those decisions with the right data.
So stupid Hunter Biden's been suddenly advising Biden. Hunter has no expertise, no objective vantage (it's hard to give good advice to someone you love and admire), and a conflict of interest (wants pardon/commute).
It's a really, really bad game Biden's been suddenly playing.
Biden has already said multiple times that he's not going to pardon his son.
That aside, where did you hear that Hunter is suddenly advising Biden in an official capacity?
>Biden has not broken any laws, but he has violated two important norms. First, he brought his son Hunter in to serve as an adviser in White House meetings. “Longtime aides to the president,” reports Politico, “are now raising concerns about Hunter Biden’s new presence alongside the president in meetings.” Or, as NBC News puts it less delicately, “Another person familiar with the matter said the reaction from some senior White House staff members has been, ‘What the hell is happening?’”
>\[...\] Hunter is reportedly surpassing Joe’s longtime advisers, a troubling dynamic that calls into question whether the president is even attempting to distinguish between what’s good for himself and what’s good for the Democratic party and the United States, let alone whether he’ll succeed.
>Donald Trump did something similar throughout his term in office, using family members to give advice despite a lack of qualifications and enormous conflicts of interest. Democrats bitterly and correctly denounced this arrangement. To accept it now would be to forfeit their standing to attack Trump’s norm-shattering mix of family and business.
[https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/joe-biden-ethics-lapses-cognitive-test-hunter-biden.html](https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/joe-biden-ethics-lapses-cognitive-test-hunter-biden.html)
Everyone leaves off the next line Schiff said:
"He should take a moment to make the best informed judgement, and if the judgement is 'run', then run hard and beat the SOB."
It couldn’t also be because the media is hammering it home every fucking second and not talking about Trump showing up in the Epstein docs that got released, or project 2025, or anything negative about him at all that makes him dangerous. No it’s just because he’s 3 years older than his opponent
Every article since the debate has been about Biden’s age. The NYT has a personal vendetta against him. The only Trump story I’ve seen today is his possible running mates.
He is judging the situation by normal political standards. He of all people should know and understand these are not normal times. Biden is running against a cult. It doesn't matter who the Democratic candidate is they should winning. The fact that it is close isn't about Biden it is because something is gravely wrong in this country.
I can only hope that democratic leaders and high-profile anti-Trumpers can see how dangerous it is for THEM. Trump getting elected again is going to suck for us, but we're inconsequential no ones. We joke about people "accidentally" falling out of windows a lot in Putin's Russia, but Trump's opponents are kidding themselves if they think it couldn't happen to them.
No, because the problem of Biden's age and capabilities is real. Despite Trump's overwhelming downsides, voters do have a real, un-media spun criticism that Biden cannot handle his duties. It is a fundamentally Biden problem.
Schiff said instead of picking a replacement right now, step one is Biden deciding to pass the torch. We will get to the other steps after step one.
Why is Reuters trying to frame Schiff as supporting Kamala Harris for the nomination? He did not say that.
Biden has made his decision and reiterated it over and over. The fact that Schiff is acting like Biden hasn't made his decision is a polite way of communicating that the decision wasn't the right one
Despite what Biden has said dems in DC perceive Biden to making his decision about whether to stay in or not. Biden cannot say he is considering quitting until the moment he announces he is stepping down. Hence all the pressure from politicians and donors right now. I think there is still some chance Biden gets out if the narrative remains focused on the issue.
Yea this is exactly it. Until he is 100% sure, he can’t say anything other than “I AM RUNNING” publicly. Being even slightly wishy washy about it would show a huge vulnerability.
Nothing is stopping Biden from u-turning despite his bravado.
Will he? I dont think so. But he could easily say "I've spent valuable time reflecting on the current state of America, and I worked with some of the people I trust most. I've made the hard decision to not run for re-election to better ensure that fascism does not take over this country and is left in excellent hands for the future. I will help support any nominee and we must take down Trump. Make your voice heard this election, or watch this country fall to bigoted fascism."
Just that alone would spark the independent voters whose apathy towards this election reached its boiling point after back to back failures for Biden in the debate + the interview from the other day where he didn't look much better.
I mean of course until he actually drops out he's going to say publicly he's 100% in. Otherwise he might as well just drop out. Considering the level of conversation around him stepping aside, it's far from a done deal IMO.
I just can't support somebody who when asked what he would think should Trump beat him, responds "I won't have any regrets as long as I tried my best". Well I want somebody running who will be completely depressed and upset if they lose to Trump.
That’s great for *him*. Good mindset to keep yourself sane.
All I can say is there are a lot more people depending on Trump losing than just Biden. You can bet a lot of us will have regret if Trump wins.
Shit goes downhill FAST if that happens - to the extent that it’s probably smartest to leave the country if you can. Might seem overly cautious, but if it comes to pass, all bets are effectively off.
This isn’t like the first election. Trump has made this election about whether or not America wants him to wield absolute power. Electing the wannabe dictator this time will give him a mandate to be a dictator over the most powerful country in the world, with an entire right wing propaganda media sphere backing him.
It won’t be good for anyone but his butt buddy authoritarians like Putin and Xi. “Regret” is an understatement. After Biden’s debate performance and its lasting impact, if that happens it will destroy his and the DNC’s reputation entirely. You thought people were pissed off at RBG? It will be that tenfold. The left in this country will be in complete disarray, and the right will be wayyyyy too happy to steamroll over them. Paint paradise and put up a fake-gold-plated Trump-brand ~~hotel~~ “grab em by the pussy” rape sanctuary.
I would actually respect Biden more if he stepped aside. And it would ensure his legacy. Even if whoever steps up to the plate loses, Biden won’t be at fault. As it stands, he’s about to be hit with *all* of the blame if things go south. If we can swing a new candidate, we should.
If we can’t… I mean I’ll still vote for Biden because 2024 Hitler duh
Jeez... I am watching that interview right now. He went so far than just asking Biden to reconsider. He is telling him to listen to people "with some distance". This is as blunt as you can get as to pointing out who is behind all these.
Where were these concerns a year ago?
Establishment Dems are the absolute worst they put us in this position and now want to self sabotage so they can hedge and pretend they “knew better” if Biden loses despite Biden being their candidate
They have to ride him until November it needs to be done and everyone needs to show up and vote. However, win or lose its way past time Dem leadership take all the criticism and all the accountability and not just let them shut down any discussion as "pro-Trump/russian propaganda" or throw progressive voters under the bus.
Biden barricades himself away from them.
The Democrats are not some well run organization, they just have more of a moral compass than Republicans do. Republicans are way better "ran" as an org than Democrats are, even if the Repubs are full of hatred.
Why are Dems speaking out now? Because even they didn't know Biden was in this rough of shape, because he barricades himself away from it all.
It isn't like being a Dem Governor/Senator means you can just call Biden and have an honest talk with him. He only keeps yes-men around him and doesn't take criticism from his party directly, and Joe isn't online reading what people think of him.
Hell, it was obvious in 2020.
In 2019, Obama reportedly told him, "you don't have to do this, Joe."
(Obligatory YES I will vote for Biden if he's still on the ballot in November because Trump's authoritarianism is an existential threat.)
I know she is not liked at all but I gotta say, obviously in my own personal opinion, if you put a younger fully functioning candidate up against the gibberish that Trump spouts while he suddenly becomes the new oldest person anyone has ever seen, it's probably going to cause a significant shift in her favor. If Biden had managed to forcefully counter Trump's stream of gibberish at the debate he would be surging, he clearly can't and I think someone that could would pick up steam pretty rapidly.
That’s how I feel. I believe any younger Dem who can speak coherently and say shit like “we want women to control their own bodies” and “we don’t need a felon for president” should be a winner. I’d think? I don’t know anymore.
Yeah I think any younger person with average politician speaking skills is going to at worst break even with what we have now. But many of us feel we’re already seeing the best Biden can do and it can only get worse as he gets more frustrated and dogged by his deteriorating image.
Totally agree. I think her unfavorables and poor history of building a team make a Whitmer or Newsome nomination more likely but your point about the juxtaposition of old ass trump and someone younger and more vibrant stands and is important.
It makes Whitmer and Newsom more ideal but not more likely. Kamala is still the favorite simply by being VP. If Biden drops out I'd give her a 75% chance of being the nominee even with an open primary.
Also I think Kamala would keep the team she has with Biden? Of course it would center around her but one of the reasons for her being the nominee is because she could inherit alot of the Biden/Harris campaign very easily.
Then Fox News will call her "shrill" and make veiled jokes about "angry black women".
Of course, they'll manage to be equally offensive about anyone without an (R) next to their name so that shouldn't be a deciding factor.
> "I think she (Harris) very well could win overwhelmingly, but before we get into a decision about who else it should be, the president needs to make a decision about whether it's him," Schiff told NBC News on Sunday.
It is huge coming from Adam Schiff
I get the skepticism over Harris. If Biden drops i think there are definitely better choices to replace him. That being said i think there are a number of things people are not really considering when it comes to her unpopularity:
1. First and foremost this is the easiest transition we can make at this point. We can immediately shift to Kamala without a complicated mini primary going into the convention.
2. Yes she was unpopular in past primaries but there really isnt much on her record that can be used against her when going against Trump. The only thing the right has is her heavy hand as a prosecutor which doesnt really work when youre trying to say the dems are soft on crime.
3. There will be an immediate contrast between a quick, intelligent Kamala and both Biden and Trump.
4. She has had some bad moments immediately post roe but the fact that she is a woman may actually help given abortion is basically on the ballot.
5. If there is another debate she will do very well against Trump.
6. She will get to own the best of Bidens record but be able to distinguish herself where necessary.
7. She can pick a Shapiro or Beshear as vp.
Kamala is not my first choice and we may very well be screwed either way but I think her past polling and primary performance is not necessarily an indicator of how she will do at the top of the ticket. She will be a huge contrast to Trump and Biden which may be exactly what we need.
>but there really isnt much on her record that can be used against her when going against Trump
She has so little on her record as VP, yet her approval ratings have been some of the worst for a VP in recent memory. Her approval rating is worse than it was for Dan Quayle.
Al Gore was in the Senate for 8 years, then VP. He had a record on environment, internet, reducing bureaucracy. Not my favorite politician, but he made sense when he spoke, was calm, and actually answered questions.
As a former climate scientist, I think the greatest tragedy about Gore is that if he was elected, we would have actually had a chance at taking action to mitigate climate change when it still might have made a difference. The damage from that alone is incalculable.
We are trying to win Wisconsin, rural PA, North Carolina, Michigan, Virginia, NV, and Arizona.
If this highly unpopular, female, black/indian, prosecutor had 2 years to make a case to those voters, sure.
But she would have 3 months. 3 MONTHS. To convince a bunch of racist, sexist, xenophobic people that’s she’s fine.
NO ONE CARES about reddit’s liberal opinions, repeat this to Yourself. They think on a different wavelength than you do. Dems already have NY, Cali, Chicago, Maine, VT, CT, Washington state. We don’t need more of their votes it doesn’t do anything.
I repeat, it doesn’t do anything. We’re trying to win over right leaning rural white voters who would rather not have trump.
Biden can step down once he wins the election.
Progressives don’t like Harris either. She basically only appeals the to the core of the dem voting base. She’s too woke (and too black and too female) for conservatives or and too ivory tower CA to appeal to rural America. She’s too much of a cop to appeal to progressives so what is her appeal.
Omigod thank you!! These people think Harris is in any way electable have to be the people who think racism is over or isn’t that bad. Not to mention Biden, himself, hurt her image when he stated he would nominate “a woman” for VP. Now she’ll also have to contend with the allegation she’s not “qualified” for the job (highly unfair and untrue, but will absolutely work against her). It’s Biden or bust.
I think a lot of people take those statements and get super defensive, thinking that the people making those statements are basically equating them with open bigots and notorious racists. But it's not like that.
Unfortunately even people who are well meaning still carry implicit biases. Even socially conscious people who are aware of inequalities and privilege (what the right refers to as "woke") can still have some internal biases. That's what comes from existing in a society where shit like the Civil Rights Movement in the south and women not being allowed to have bank accounts is still *in living memory*. I consider myself to be a socially conscious person and I still have to stop, think, and examine my internal biases once in a while. I like to think I'm introspective enough to call myself out on those things, but a lot of people can't or won't acknowledge that they have those internal biases even when they consider themselves open minded.
We saw it a LOT with Clinton. Plenty of men and women who consider themselves to be respectful of women and are horrified by misogyny still bought into some of the gender bias against her. A lot of the comments about Clinton's unlikability were dog whistles that basically attacked her gender ("shrill", "argumentative", etc.). Things that people wouldn't have even thought about in a male candidate became issues for her.
It is very painful for a lot of people to accept that misogyny and racism are still huge factors in our country. It's even more painful for people to accept that they still -- even unconsciously -- perpetuate those things themselves. But it's willful ignorance to say that those things aren't issues.
Those of us in CA know her record as AG and Senator. Three persistent things emerge. 1. She expects things to happen, rather than her putting in a lot of work. 2. Tons of staff people turning over. 3. Speeches that don’t make sense. Those often include the same few phrases that opponents like to mock. Like “unburdened by what has been”
Without reliable data, saying that she is going to win or definitely can't win is useless to the discussion.
**Edit** : and as if to prove my point we have dueling replies saying that she is on top of polling and also the least popular VP in recent history.
I mean there’s now pretty ample polling out on Kamala, and unlike for many of the other candidates, it’s somewhat useful since she has very high name recognition & familiarity rates. She’s up on Biden nationally, but a bit weaker in the Rust Belt & Sun Belt states *as of now*.
Obviously a ton can change as she actually campaigns, and her VP pick would be a huge deal.
Guy who wrote the (new) 538 model gives a good breakdown: https://x.com/gelliottmorris/status/1809675493459071190?s=46
Here's my hypothesis (which are usually wrong). Everyone has gone four years without hearing actual, non-crazy, non-old speech. That it's like an arms race where whoever gets a younger candidate first will shoot up in the polls just from relief and from the vacuum that's existed.
So Harris (or whoever) would go up a bit once she gets a spotlight, not decline.
That’s a hunch I have too. The first party to dump their current late 70s + candidate and replace with one a generation (or two) younger will win in a landslide. Hopefully it’s the one that leans toward supporting democracy and popular policies. Since this probably hasn’t been polled, all we have are hunches.
Polls definitely show her as one of the least popular VPs in our lifetimes.
>What we do know is that Harris is viewed far more unfavorably than favorably in poll after poll. **Her numbers are lower than her four immediate predecessors at this point in their terms,** though Dan Quayle’s unfavorables were worse. So were Dick Cheney’s in his second term. Harris’ latest favorable rating in the July 1-5 Economist/YouGov poll was 39% of registered voters, while 55% viewed her unfavorable, a 16 percentage point difference.
https://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/election/presidential-election/article277246198.html
But he has it backwards, it only makes sense for Biden to step down if there’s a candidate we can solidly point to as his replacement. And Harris isn’t going to get moderates to come out. Until they have that “clear winner” candidate identified, they need to stop shooting at Biden and hurting our chances in THREE MONTHS.
Biden has been old for a while now, if this was really their concern, it should have been brought up years ago, not now. Now we need to rally behind him, because it’s unrealistic to push for a new candidate and win now.
Harris can win IF she comes out FIGHTING.
"As a former prosecutor, I WILL NOT allow a rapist, convicted felon to hold the highest office in the land and suppress the rights of women and people of color."
No mealy mouthed Soul Of The Nation talk. Attack. Every statement or response to Trump should be about how he diddles kids, and is 30x convicted felon.
Her running as a cop before played like a bootlicker to The System at best and a jackboot at worst, but against Trump directly, after his convictions and the Epstein releases, it'll play like Dems are the Law And Order party compared to the criminal anarchy of the right.
I didn't have "Democratic candidate campaigns by leaning into the Thin Blue Line" on my 2024 bingo card, but if it keeps Trump out of office I'll take it.
Exactly... none of this 'when they go low, we go high' bullshit. Sorry, Michelle Obama!
When they go low... kick them in the balls.
There's a time and place to take the high road, and its *not* when the stakes are this high. I DONT want to see Kamala (if she gets the nomination) take the high road. As you said, come out fighting.
Schiff’s comments, while not exactly a call to drop out, are not holding up the facade that Biden camp would like in the slightest. This may be the most important break so far. It opens the door for senators to take the same position or go further. There is no holding back these waters. Joe, please do this quickly and save yourself the sense that you made the decision that needs to be made!
Wait until after the RNC starting in a week and Trump has to give a live speech in prime time. Don't let anything distract from that. Frame it as Trump is too much of a risk for a candidate that people are unsure of.
Joe's legacy will be tarnished if he loses. He should step aside. Harris isn't my preferred candidate, but she's a magnitude of order better than Biden.
The headline frames it wrong. The real story is that he said that the president needs to decide about his candidacy - which is a door cracked open at saying he should step aside - he went on to say that the path from there could only be unlocked by Biden stepping down and that he felt that if the process led to Kamala then she would win overwhelmingly (again pointing to the idea, without being explicit, that Biden would not.) The real headline is that Schiff just gave permission for senators to take even firmer stances, I think.
More than just cracking the door opened. He told Biden to listen to people "with some distance". This is no longer a wishy washy stand. This is official approval for people to speak out.
If Joe steps down, he will cement his legacy as a distinguished public servant and steward of democracy. If he carries forward and loses, he will be a stubborn old man who put his ego first at the great expense to the country.
If Schiff is opening the door on this I expect it'll be a pretty rough week for Team Biden.
I'm in favor of Biden dropping out or being pushed out if necessary but my heart does break for him a bit. He seemed so hurt and in denial that this was going to happen during the Stephanopoulos interview, it made me genuinely sad. I still think it needs to happen but I hope he doesn't finish his life feeling betrayed or sad. He did a great job as president and should live on in history as a dedicated public servant.
His senior staff on the other hand should be run out of town on a rail for letting this happen. They let him down and they let the country down. This all could have happened a lot cleaner of he hadn't run again.
"His senior staff, on the other hand should be run out of town on a rail for letting this happen."
This. Many advisers, staffers, family, media, etc, are complicit here. Where were they? It's not just the future, they let Joe ruin his legacy. This is like a plane crash. Usually, for a plane to crash, multiple things have to go wrong.
- Joe should NEVER have run
- DNC/family/advisors needed to stop him, and go public.
- Joe needed a popular VP who could beat Trump.
- Staff needed to be more transparent so the public could slowly digest it instead of dropping a dementia nuke.
I got that vibe too. He's either a brilliant actor, or he's genuinely convinced that he is the best possible solution. The fact that he can't see the truth of the current situation is a bit tragic.
I do feel more confident after watching the ABC interview though. It's clear the debate was a low point. The question remains, though - how frequent are these low points, and how fast will he deteriorate?
I don’t like Biden that much but I do know being president was his lifelong dream (his first campaign was in the 80’s) and finally getting that job only to be too old must be soul-crushing plus he probably isn’t even fully cognizant of how far he’s declined most old people aren’t
The fact that a large number of establishment Dems are still talking about Biden stepping aside after his interview where he explicitly said “I’m not leaving Jack” really makes me wonder. I feel the flood gates are going to open when Congress returns tomorrow.
He had to say that no matter what. He can't even hint he is considering leaving until he makes the decision, because there is no coming back - if people hear he is considering leaving, he is finished and has to leave (because why would he consider it, if he is ok?).
I don't think they are brave enough to do it. But I think they should use the convention to do what is technically there for. They should have people nominated to replace Biden on the ticket. They should debate openly. Have votes. Decide on candidate together and then unite under whoever wins in name of saving democracy and moving forward as a country. But that's just a dream. I know not realistic.
Lol I'm beginning to think all politics is just theater for us peons.
The Democrats are so laughably out of touch with reality and the Republicans are so fucking obviously evil.
Always has been. Not even a joke. Look at the drama between our very first cabinet. It’s usually a few people bickering about what they think is best and trash talking each other to the public.
What I can say, from watching her debate with Pence, is that she would absolutely obliterate Trump in a debate. She would absolutely scorch him when he attempts to interrupt.
It would honestly be pretty fire.
I was curious and just watched it 30 mins ago. I forgot how well she did with Pence. I also watched a clip when she debated Biden. Also great. Trump will look like the misogynist he is if he interrupts, talks over, or responds in a disrespectful way.
I just think its sad that Pete Buttigieg will not get a chance any time soon because he is gay. That is the ONLY reason he won’t get elected.
He is an outstanding candidate.
"PoliticsGirl" (Leigh McGowan) has a video called ["Kamala did what?"](https://youtu.be/DJeltMiTZXo) listing how many changes Kamala Harris implemented without nearly getting the media attention of Biden.
A few key successes (will add links, if I find any from reputable sources):
- Expanding health care coverage to millions of citizens, particularly reproductive rights and maternal healthcare
- Increasing the minimum wage by pushing for a raise for all workers on federal projects
- Encouraging more union membership in the federal workforce (Union membership is up by 20% since she began)
- Supporting Ukraine https://www.reuters.com/world/us-vp-announces-15-billion-aid-ukraine-peace-summit-switzerland-2024-06-15/
- Strengthening relationships with Ghana, Tanzania and Zambia https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/27/world/africa/kamala-harris-visit.html
- Visiting Vietnam, Singapore and Japan to strengthen the supply chains for computer chips, reducing the US' dependence on China. https://www.brookings.edu/articles/what-did-kamala-harris-trip-do-for-us-engagement-in-southeast-asia/
- Extending gun control (assault weapon ban, background checks)
- Calling out Florida's social studies standards (which DeSantis claimed to not have authored, but chose to defend as "factual" anyway 🤡) as "gaslighting" and "revisionist" for portraying slavery as "beneficial for developing skills" to the enslaved people. https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2023/jul/24/kamala-harris/do-Florida-school-standards-say-enslaved-people/
Further plans:
- Expand "Build Back Better" for healthcare, income and housing, if Dems regain congress
- Advocacy for debt-free college
If all of this is correct, then I'm convinced she's qualified to do his job.
Biden must act now and use the expanded powers of the president ruled by the SCOTUS to detain Trump and the conservative Supreme Court justices in whatever facility has replaced Guantanamo Bay. When their lawyers challenge it, the case will come before the new SCOTUS appointees, at which time the ruling can be fixed/overturned and this miscarriage of democracy can be corrected.
Harris is a huge risk. The potential payoff is huge, but she's a black woman that needs to win over voters in WI, MI, and PA. Would she do better than Biden? I'm skeptical.
> Unite around a candidate!
Agree but in this crucial election we need to unite around a candidate who is able to attract Independent voters in Swing States, and that is not Harris. Party unity by itself will not be enough.
Its 3 months from the damn elections. This party does everything in its power to make its supporters regret the two party system. Its 3 fucking months, if you attempt to force out Biden now than you look weak and unorganized. The time to fish for a new candidate was two years ago. It’s honestly regrettable that Republican party is such a shit show that my vote is basically held hostage to this ridiculously out of touch party.
The election will be decided by two groups. 1) Independent voters, and 2) pissed off women.
The majority of Independents don't like Trump but they're also not high on Biden, especially now. Everyone I speak with is angry that these two are the choices. If those people stay home, Biden is toast. Would they come out and vote for Harris? I think she might have a better chance honestly.
It's just bonkers to me that democrats are pushing this. I mean, are you kidding me? Not a snowballs chance in hell she would win against Trump. What planet do these folks live on?
The Democratic establishment deciding whose turn it is next is how Trump got elected in the first place. Kamala doesn't have wide support and is tied to the Biden administration and his low approval ratings. He did a great job, but the public isn't widely aware of that.
We need somebody who the Republican media and their Russian backers aren't prepared for.
I love how everyone is clairvoyant, thinking that replacing Biden will result in an automatic win for Democrats. What if he’s replaced and Trump still wins in November? Then the Dems will be screaming that they lost because Biden was replaced.
Gotta say, anyone who seriously thinks Harris can get up onstage and win a crowd is stacking delusion on top of delusion. I've seen her speak and she has the charisma of a discarded tax form. Her only national accomplishment so far is coming near last in the 2020 primaries and she's been sitting on the bench the last 4 years--she's only known for losing, so why is the pick to win possibly the most important election in national history?
Look at basically every election in the last century and the more charismatic candidate always wins. Every time we try to pretend this is the one exceptional campaign, it backfires.
* In 2000, everyone said it didn't matter that Bush was more charismatic than Gore because who would vote for Bush?
* In 2004, everyone said it didn't matter that we were running two East Coast superwealthy lawyers that the public disliked, because who would vote for Bush?
* In 2008, everyone said it didn't matter that Obama was drawing huge crowds--Hillary's resume was definitely better so who would vote for Obama? At least we got to out-charisma the Republicans in 2008 and 2012, for a change. Romney was a richer, more obnoxious Kerry--who thought that was a good idea?
* 2016, everyone said it didn't matter that charisma was Hillary's dump stat because "it was her turn" and who would vote for Trump anyways?
* 2020, we barely managed to squeeze in a low-to-mid charisma candidate (Biden) because Trump had half destroyed America. And even then, we had to leverage Biden's more popular Obama connection very hard.
Keep going back before 2000 and the pattern holds. I seriously think that if you were to spin blindfolded on the convention floor, odds are you'd win up pointing at a better candidate. What are we doing? Are we even trying to win anymore?
Do you really think any other democrat candidate has any chance other than Biden at winning the election at this point in the race, honestly? Because I don’t. It’s so funny to me we have all of this “liberal” media saying how much of a disaster he was and calling for his resignation with barely any focus on Trump and his millions of lies on national television when our literal democracy is at stake. Instead I have to hear about a guy being too fucking old when the other guy is literally a facist. Don’t like Biden fine, policy wise if people pay attention which they don’t he’s done a lot, but that doesn’t matter and the media sure as fuck doesn’t talk about that. For these so called liberal and neutral networks they sure have no problem getting conservatives elected must it be a giant coincidence. Fuckin’ all complicit in getting Trump re-elected if he wins. So tired of this shit.
I’d vote for Harris just to see how mad the racist right wingers get when a black woman becomes president.
That, and I’m pretty sure she doesn’t wanna be a dictator like Trump does. This is really my main requirement in 2024 from a candidate: do not desire to be a dictator. Pretty simple. Oh and no matter what I’m voting. And no matter what I’m not voting trump. And no matter what I’ll be voting for whoever is most likely to defeat trump. Meaning Green Party no thanks, meaning most likely whoever the official Democratic Party candidate is.
Just make a choice. If Joe can do it, put everything we've got behind him. If it's Kamala, same thing. Democracy is on the line.
Though I do think a Whitmer/Shapiro ticket would be exactly what we need.
I don't have a problem with Harris but I don't believe for a second she has better chances to win than Biden. She's a brown woman and he's an old white guy: one of those is way more likely to be president than the other.
(Don't get me wrong; I don't like that it's like that, but that's still the reality of things)
This circular firing squad BS isn’t funny. Put your focus where it should be Congressman, Trump is a rapist and felon who wants to destroy America. Quit talking shit about Biden, if he dies then Harris will step up, until and unless that happens, he’s the nominee.
Ok a switch to Kamala would be two steps backward. Maybe even most reviled Dem in national spotlight. Need a clean break from folks in the admin and pick from purple state Dem governors.
>Need a clean break from folks in the admin and pick from purple state Dem governors.
This. Poll after poll shows that eligible voters across party lines list two issues as the most important by far: 1) Economy/Cost of Living, and 2) the Immigration Crisis. This has not changed for over a year now and these concerns have to be acknowledged.
Democratic opinions are deeply divided on Harris, even ITT. But she will clearly carry the baggage of this administration on these issues. On the other hand, successful governors like Whitmer and Newsom don't carry that baggage, and have extensive experience running a state that Harris does not possess. Also they are both excellent speakers while Harris' word salads are widely lampooned.
There are a lot of Democrats who will Vote Blue No Matter Who (and I've always fallen into this category myself). But that is not enough to win over swing state Independents in this election, and we need to win.
So, they're saying,if Biden steps down, it's Harris's "turn". What happened to electing these fools into their positions? It's nobody's "turn" except for who the American people decide it to be. Right?
> What happened to electing these fools into their positions?
The DNC took one look at the dem primary and said "lol no, you're gonna take Biden and you're gonna like it". Dems are so worried about the loss of democracy when it already happened from within their own party
Omg... No she wont... SHE IS NOT EVEN LIKED IN HER HOME STATE! She is a cop who defends qualified immunity for police and backs corporations over unions. This is not the winning ticket. Democrats are overreacting to the debate and propping up the weakest candidate by a mile. Hand Trump his pardon at this point. As another commenter pointed out as well, we don't need the states where Dems poll well. We need the swing states that are filled with sexist, xenophoic, racist peoples who would need way more than 3 months to be potentially sold on Harris.
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>"Either he (Biden) has to win overwhelmingly, or he has to pass the torch to someone who can."
The media portrays it's only for Kamala, but in context Adam is just saying Biden has to win overwhelmingly or pass it off, which in either case is obvious..however the media is misleading the public. -how is that not misinformation and destroy the reporters and it's companies credibility?
This is the same media actively helping a convicted felon and likely pedophile by complaining about Bidens age. The same ones ignoring the Epstein docs. They are not a friend of democracy.
4th estate essentially elected Trump and created this monster. Without media he would be just a wacko. Now his every utterance is front page news from both liberal and conservative news outlets.
Along with the almost always present “here’s why that is bad for Biden” taglines.
Trump is a convicted felon, rapist, and thief that steals money from veterans. Here’s bidens top 3 stutters over the last month in response:
“A sextape featuring Trump and his daughter was just released! And this is why that’s bad for Biden!”
“BREAKING: Leaked video shows Trump on his knees performing fellatio on President Vladimir Putin of Russia. Here’s why this is the final nail in the coffin for Biden.
Reads like an SNL sketch.
I can't fucking watch the news anymore because they start every show about who's telling Biden to resign. It's ridiculous.
Yup, I definitely recall them keeping their cameras on an empty fuckin podium waiting for candidate Trump to make a statement. Meanwhile other candidates were already at events speaking.
The 4th estate has become a 5th column.
Noticed this morning the Washington Post had 11 articles about the dire condition of the Biden campaign and exactly one article about Trump. I haven't seen any articles on Project 25 and what it is. Connections between Project 25 and Trump and not a word about the Epstein dump.
Let’s not forget it was part of the Hillary 2016 campaign strategy to elevate trump in the primary because they thought he’d be easiest to beat in the general. Lots of blame to go around here.
Its because theres no news in printing thing like “Trumps a liar!” because everyone knows it, and none of his followers care. But to print “Bidens too old, did you see that debate?!” causes fear and anxiety and thats good for the media. It’s pretty sad that they still manipulate the masses, but thats how it goes I guess.
Jumping up and down screaming at the world about all the lies lacks impact when voters really believe everyone is lying.
I will never get tired of pointing out an old, rapey, racist, fascist felon is trying to run for president. How is turning Ridiculous to 11 considered a valid strategy?
>**I think she (Harris) very well could win overwhelmingly**, but before we get into a decision about who else it should be, the president needs to make a decision about whether it's him Shift also very clearly said that Harris could win overwhelmingly. The article title isn’t misleading, it’s quoting a different quote then the one above.
Yeah but it’s more fun to read half an article, run back to Reddit to post some anti-media thing that will get upvoted to the top comment by people who didn’t read any of it.
"I think she (Harris) very well could win overwhelmingly, but before we get into a decision about who else it should be, the president needs to make a decision about whether it's him," Schiff told NBC News on Sunday. —— How is *your* post not misinformation to destroy the reporter’s and Reuter’s credibility? It’s like the third paragraph in the article.
I want to give you a hug for assuming they actually read the article.
I think the media has decided the storyline this season involves Biden dropping out late in the race, in either case in the hopes Trump will win as he's good for clicks. Its why they couldn't leave him alone for four years and kept platforming him.
Showing the party has a backbone would go a long way to securing a vote. Due to the new ruling he could legally get rid of 3 SCOTUS judges, judge Cannon, and Trump party candidate Donald J Trump LEGALLY, 4/5 before the SCOTUS ruling. Americans deserve to have atleast 1 party in the government who will defend the constitution.
>He should be mopping the floor with Donald Trump. Joe Biden is running against a criminial. It should not be even close, and there's only one reason it is close, and that's the President's age. >What I would advise the President is, seek out the opinions of people you trust. He's obviously talked to his family about this and that's important but he should seek out people with some distance and objectivity. He should seek out pollsters who are not his own pollsters. Wow, this is pretty huge. No real way to spin that. e: [Here's](https://youtu.be/xx-cvDy6p-8?si=Efdy6PS2iTAcMlrv) the full interview.
Regardless who wins between the two men, the oldest president ever would be elected. Why does old work against Biden and not Trump?
Because age is the worst thing Biden has going for him. He also is acting older than he has before. Trump has way worse shit to talk about so age is the least of his problems, because he has so many. He also acts relatively younger when he speaks, so it’s held against him less.
It's "forgetful mushmouth grandpa" v. "aggressive ranting grandpa". Ignoring everything else, I know which one I'd rather deal with as a leader.
> I know which one I'd rather deal with as a leader. Sure you do, but you are NOT the deciding factor. Those 10-15% undecided are.
No, it’s forgetful mush mouth grandpa vs lying narcissistic criminal grandpa.
What sucks is that Trump has moments where he’s speaking incoherently. Like his words (or often times his tweets) make no logical sense, but he says them with energy, so people just overlook it. Biden sounds tired, but what he’s saying is actually coherent most of the time.
>He also acts relatively younger when he speaks, so it’s held against him less. I disagree with this. The content of what trump says is waaaay worse than what Biden says. Trump says literal word salads of dog whistles and sound bites. It's just that he's louder. Trump's posture when he speaks is more animated, sure, but it's still the movements of an old has-been used car salesman. Agreed that the only thing Biden can be criticized for is his age, and, yes, Trump should be criticized for his age, too. As well as Trump's abysmal record and history.
You know how often the popular kids in high school were dumb bullies? It's a lot like that.
2016 was literally a bully vs a nerd and we proved that adults in red states don’t mature past high school.
Here in a red state, I was screaming that I voted for Leslie Knope aka the nerd who had a plan for everything… meanwhile my parents in a blue state voted for the bully. (They have since stated their deep regret for being part of the problem, voted for Biden and will do so again.) But yeah. Your point stands, just less absolute than red v blue.
I am still saddened that my late father became a Trump supporter before he passed. We watched the 2016 GOP convention and I was fact-checking Trump in real time, he got really agitated by that. His last vote was for Trump, but my only solace was because of our stupid electoral college system and his living in a blue state, that his vote didn't actually "count".
> mature past high school. You are being generous
Look, I can't stand Trump and I agree that the content of what he says is bonkers and incoherent. But he's got quick answers and one liners. He's animated when he talks. His line "I don't know what he said at the end of his last sentence. I don't think he knows, either" was devastating. Biden just stood there with his mouth agape, looking like he wasn't sure if he was at a debate, or if he was waiting for visiting hours to start at the nursing home. Biden went into a debate where he knew his age was the biggest issue. The fact that he did even worse than anyone thought possible was a horrible sign. How bad would it have gotten if he hadn't been making an effort to (wildly unsuccessfully) combat the perception that he's not up to the task. Biden is 81 but could easily pass for 91. He's frail and feeble, except in the most controlled environments. But this actually highlights an even bigger problem for Democrats: they simply don't give a shit what the electorate thinks. They've decided that people shouldn't care about his age, so they've tried just waving away and dismissing those concerns. They've decided that the one issue everyone should care about is the preservation of democracy. That's my top issue, but it's not the top issue for the vast vast majority of voters. But, that's what they've decided people SHOULD care about, so that's what the campaign is about. It's not so much a campaign asking for votes as it is a lecture tour. If Biden stays in, I'm voting for him and begging everyone I know to do the same. But as Democrats, we have got to stop pretending that issues don't exist because it's not what the professional political class cares about. I pray that something happens that removes Trump as a candidate. But I'm the event my prayers aren't answered, we need to do a hell of a lot better than this.
The problem is that Trump has basically normalized his behavior, and the media has largely accepted it. You can no longer criticize his word salads because everyone just goes “well Trump’s gonna Trump, what can you do?”. It’s infuriating
I'm of the opinion that many Americans are really dumb, as seen in the 2016 election. Loud and unapologetic plays really well with that group, and the lies don't register with them. It really doesn't matter what he says, it's how he says it. Smart voters don't fall for his shtick.
Yes, but Trump has always talked that way, whereas Biden has had a noticeable drop off.
> Trump has always talked that way Trump was fairly articulate back in the 90s. It's just that his drop off has been longer and more gradual. [Here he is on Oprah in the 90s saying the exact same things he says today](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEPs17_AkTI).
He talks that way simply as a put on for his audience.
He sounds exactly the same, honestly. He's only slightly more articulate in that video than he is today. Which is to say, even in this video, he speaks in bumbling generalities.
No one is comparing the content of the speech, just the body language and energy. Joe could barely get a sentence out that made sense. He kept tripping over his words and you could barely hear the guy. Anyone being honest can see that Trump and Biden are not aging the same. Biden is foggy, he’s slow, hes tired. And he should be, because he’s fucking 81 and that’s normal. But the wolf of fascism is here, sniffing under the door, and I just don’t think a tired old man is the right choice to defend us. We need a newsom or a whitmer or an AOC. Someone who not only gives a fuck about this country but is educated, witty and intelligent. Hell, put Jon Stewart up there and watch him mop the floor with Trump.
Did you watch the debate? Trump is a bit slower than previous campaigns but not by a huge margin. He just seems a lot younger. If Biden had the quickness of a decade ago no ody would talk about his age either.
Some people on this subreddit are ignoring the reality here
To be honest, Trump seemed 30 years younger than Biden in that debate.
Because Biden is showing the effects of age. Anthony Fauci is 2 years *older* than Biden and the man is still sharp as a whip. Age has caught up with Joe in a way it hasn’t with other people his age. Whether that’s a more serious health concern or weather that’s just age and stress, it’s hard to say, but it’s not *just* a number. He’s foggy, he’s tired, he’s tripping over his words, he’s asking governors for more time asleep at night. Meanwhile Trump is rage tweeting on the toilet at 3am and ran circles around Biden (even if his pants were on fire the entire time). That’s why.
Exactly. I hate to say it, but humans are as dumb as dogs. We don't care what you say, as long as you say it the way we like. "I hate your face" to my dog or my buddy is the same, say it happy, they're happy. Say it angry, they feel bad. Doesn't matter that what Trump said was bullshit and bad faith, he said it in a way that wags the average voters tail. We're fucked.
Ratings. Eyeballs. Capitalism. Ad spots. Outrage makes a lot of money.
I'll repeat what's been said a thousand times already, but it's because age has caught up with Biden much faster. Here's 2020 debates. Trump is a little slower now. Biden is **much** slower now. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wW1lY5jFNcQ
Ya, do these people remember Joe in 2012??? He's lost like 10 steps since then. Are we going to sit up here an lie about that?
He’s lost a step since 2020 and even then it was pretty apparent he was getting too old.
I'm convinced there are a lot of people on the Democrat's side who were activated by Trump and have very little political memory of the time before him. I had the same conversation with 3 different well meaning, #resistance type people about Ginsburg on Twitter years back where they were adamant that people who suggested she should have resigned are idiots that have no concept of how things work bc we all know the Republicans never ever, not once, allowed Obama to put someone on the Supreme Court. When kagan and Sotomayora are brought up, they seem unaware of them. One person actually told me they didn't realize he had put 2 justices on the court prior to the GOP controlling the Senate. They mean well but just don't really remember much from 2015 back, probably bc they weren't political. The same people often say Bush wasnt that bad, that points to them not really paying attention bc Bush basically laid the groundwork for every bad thing Trump did These people definitely don't remember that debate and seem to have an outsized voice on social media
> The same people often say Bush wasnt that bad, that points to them not really paying attention bc Bush basically laid the groundwork for every bad thing Trump did Tbh I feel like that’s because a lot of resistance libs are more focused on Trump’s behavior and not really so much his policies. The way people have tried to redeem George W Bush is sickening to me, the dude was even worse than Trump when it came to foreign policy and helped crash our economy in 08. George W Bush is a monster, and so is Donald Trump.
Nothing works against trump because he has a rabid following of people voting and supporting based on a cocktail of precieved grievances, conspiracy theories, insecurities, disaffection, and victim complexes He is the panacea for every ill they believe the society to have. Also, this race is the difference between a well-spoken lie and a stuttered truth.
Because trump doesnt look like a vegetable as much as Joe Biden. Criminal or not - if you think they both showed the same level of «foot in the grave» you are not being objective. Coming from someone outside the US.
Because Trumpies are Voting for Trump. They dont care about his age. We should be voting for the best Candidate not a personality.
Where were these concerns a year ago? Establishment Dems are the absolute worst they put us in this position and now want to self sabotage so they can hedge and pretend they “knew better” if Biden despite Biden being their candidate If they have to ride him until November it needs to be done and everyone needs to show up and vote. However, win or lose its way past time Dem leadership take all the criticism and all the accountability and not just let them shut down any discussion as "pro-Trump/russian propaganda" or throw progressive voters under the bus.
> Establishment Dems are the absolute worst they put us in this position Yep. They had 8 fucking years to prepare for this moment. And the result? A frail old guy who doesn't know where he is half of the time. That's what they come up with to go against Trump. lol
They won in 2020. Giving up the incumbency advantage is risky - most incumbents win.
This take is so bad. “It should not be close”, it shouldn’t have in 2016 either. Should have been even better in 2020. I don’t know why people all of a sudden are pretending it’s easy to run against Trump. Have we not learned the past 2 elections that a good portion of voters don’t actually care about the lies and crap Trump says?
Apparently not learned much of why people vote for Trump at all through 3 election cycles. Since it looks like a close race again. Just endless focusing on the wrong things.
Trump is actually a strong candidate even if we are reviled by him. If we are making decisions about how to beat him let's actually frame those decisions with the right data.
Strong presidential candidate but weak as shit for down ballot races.
No, the DNC hasn’t learned shit because they keep putting up nice guy candidates when we need a fighter.
So stupid Hunter Biden's been suddenly advising Biden. Hunter has no expertise, no objective vantage (it's hard to give good advice to someone you love and admire), and a conflict of interest (wants pardon/commute). It's a really, really bad game Biden's been suddenly playing.
Biden has already said multiple times that he's not going to pardon his son. That aside, where did you hear that Hunter is suddenly advising Biden in an official capacity?
>Biden has not broken any laws, but he has violated two important norms. First, he brought his son Hunter in to serve as an adviser in White House meetings. “Longtime aides to the president,” reports Politico, “are now raising concerns about Hunter Biden’s new presence alongside the president in meetings.” Or, as NBC News puts it less delicately, “Another person familiar with the matter said the reaction from some senior White House staff members has been, ‘What the hell is happening?’” >\[...\] Hunter is reportedly surpassing Joe’s longtime advisers, a troubling dynamic that calls into question whether the president is even attempting to distinguish between what’s good for himself and what’s good for the Democratic party and the United States, let alone whether he’ll succeed. >Donald Trump did something similar throughout his term in office, using family members to give advice despite a lack of qualifications and enormous conflicts of interest. Democrats bitterly and correctly denounced this arrangement. To accept it now would be to forfeit their standing to attack Trump’s norm-shattering mix of family and business. [https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/joe-biden-ethics-lapses-cognitive-test-hunter-biden.html](https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/joe-biden-ethics-lapses-cognitive-test-hunter-biden.html)
The hypocrisy of it is infuriating. I get that the right wing has no shame and is immune to hypocrisy, but we shouldn't be.
Everyone leaves off the next line Schiff said: "He should take a moment to make the best informed judgement, and if the judgement is 'run', then run hard and beat the SOB."
It couldn’t also be because the media is hammering it home every fucking second and not talking about Trump showing up in the Epstein docs that got released, or project 2025, or anything negative about him at all that makes him dangerous. No it’s just because he’s 3 years older than his opponent Every article since the debate has been about Biden’s age. The NYT has a personal vendetta against him. The only Trump story I’ve seen today is his possible running mates.
He is judging the situation by normal political standards. He of all people should know and understand these are not normal times. Biden is running against a cult. It doesn't matter who the Democratic candidate is they should winning. The fact that it is close isn't about Biden it is because something is gravely wrong in this country.
I can only hope that democratic leaders and high-profile anti-Trumpers can see how dangerous it is for THEM. Trump getting elected again is going to suck for us, but we're inconsequential no ones. We joke about people "accidentally" falling out of windows a lot in Putin's Russia, but Trump's opponents are kidding themselves if they think it couldn't happen to them.
No, because the problem of Biden's age and capabilities is real. Despite Trump's overwhelming downsides, voters do have a real, un-media spun criticism that Biden cannot handle his duties. It is a fundamentally Biden problem.
Schiff said instead of picking a replacement right now, step one is Biden deciding to pass the torch. We will get to the other steps after step one. Why is Reuters trying to frame Schiff as supporting Kamala Harris for the nomination? He did not say that.
Biden has made his decision and reiterated it over and over. The fact that Schiff is acting like Biden hasn't made his decision is a polite way of communicating that the decision wasn't the right one
Despite what Biden has said dems in DC perceive Biden to making his decision about whether to stay in or not. Biden cannot say he is considering quitting until the moment he announces he is stepping down. Hence all the pressure from politicians and donors right now. I think there is still some chance Biden gets out if the narrative remains focused on the issue.
Yea this is exactly it. Until he is 100% sure, he can’t say anything other than “I AM RUNNING” publicly. Being even slightly wishy washy about it would show a huge vulnerability.
Nothing is stopping Biden from u-turning despite his bravado. Will he? I dont think so. But he could easily say "I've spent valuable time reflecting on the current state of America, and I worked with some of the people I trust most. I've made the hard decision to not run for re-election to better ensure that fascism does not take over this country and is left in excellent hands for the future. I will help support any nominee and we must take down Trump. Make your voice heard this election, or watch this country fall to bigoted fascism." Just that alone would spark the independent voters whose apathy towards this election reached its boiling point after back to back failures for Biden in the debate + the interview from the other day where he didn't look much better.
Nice speech, got me pumped up
I mean of course until he actually drops out he's going to say publicly he's 100% in. Otherwise he might as well just drop out. Considering the level of conversation around him stepping aside, it's far from a done deal IMO. I just can't support somebody who when asked what he would think should Trump beat him, responds "I won't have any regrets as long as I tried my best". Well I want somebody running who will be completely depressed and upset if they lose to Trump.
That’s great for *him*. Good mindset to keep yourself sane. All I can say is there are a lot more people depending on Trump losing than just Biden. You can bet a lot of us will have regret if Trump wins. Shit goes downhill FAST if that happens - to the extent that it’s probably smartest to leave the country if you can. Might seem overly cautious, but if it comes to pass, all bets are effectively off. This isn’t like the first election. Trump has made this election about whether or not America wants him to wield absolute power. Electing the wannabe dictator this time will give him a mandate to be a dictator over the most powerful country in the world, with an entire right wing propaganda media sphere backing him. It won’t be good for anyone but his butt buddy authoritarians like Putin and Xi. “Regret” is an understatement. After Biden’s debate performance and its lasting impact, if that happens it will destroy his and the DNC’s reputation entirely. You thought people were pissed off at RBG? It will be that tenfold. The left in this country will be in complete disarray, and the right will be wayyyyy too happy to steamroll over them. Paint paradise and put up a fake-gold-plated Trump-brand ~~hotel~~ “grab em by the pussy” rape sanctuary. I would actually respect Biden more if he stepped aside. And it would ensure his legacy. Even if whoever steps up to the plate loses, Biden won’t be at fault. As it stands, he’s about to be hit with *all* of the blame if things go south. If we can swing a new candidate, we should. If we can’t… I mean I’ll still vote for Biden because 2024 Hitler duh
Why is the media doing everything for more clicks? What’s new about this? The media is why we are so fucked now.
News companies have better ratings when things are horrible. Thus why they want another Trump term.
Who owns the media? It aint a bunch of liberals like us. There is your answer.
Jeez... I am watching that interview right now. He went so far than just asking Biden to reconsider. He is telling him to listen to people "with some distance". This is as blunt as you can get as to pointing out who is behind all these.
Where were these concerns a year ago? Establishment Dems are the absolute worst they put us in this position and now want to self sabotage so they can hedge and pretend they “knew better” if Biden loses despite Biden being their candidate They have to ride him until November it needs to be done and everyone needs to show up and vote. However, win or lose its way past time Dem leadership take all the criticism and all the accountability and not just let them shut down any discussion as "pro-Trump/russian propaganda" or throw progressive voters under the bus.
Plus they suck at PR. There is SO MUCH AMMO against Trump and they just don’t use it.
Biden barricades himself away from them. The Democrats are not some well run organization, they just have more of a moral compass than Republicans do. Republicans are way better "ran" as an org than Democrats are, even if the Repubs are full of hatred. Why are Dems speaking out now? Because even they didn't know Biden was in this rough of shape, because he barricades himself away from it all. It isn't like being a Dem Governor/Senator means you can just call Biden and have an honest talk with him. He only keeps yes-men around him and doesn't take criticism from his party directly, and Joe isn't online reading what people think of him.
If you haven’t noticed Biden’s decline either you’re not paying attention these past few years or it says something about your media consumption.
Hell, it was obvious in 2020. In 2019, Obama reportedly told him, "you don't have to do this, Joe." (Obligatory YES I will vote for Biden if he's still on the ballot in November because Trump's authoritarianism is an existential threat.)
We were behind Biden after the state of the union because he was sharp and could talk.
I know she is not liked at all but I gotta say, obviously in my own personal opinion, if you put a younger fully functioning candidate up against the gibberish that Trump spouts while he suddenly becomes the new oldest person anyone has ever seen, it's probably going to cause a significant shift in her favor. If Biden had managed to forcefully counter Trump's stream of gibberish at the debate he would be surging, he clearly can't and I think someone that could would pick up steam pretty rapidly.
That’s how I feel. I believe any younger Dem who can speak coherently and say shit like “we want women to control their own bodies” and “we don’t need a felon for president” should be a winner. I’d think? I don’t know anymore.
Yeah I think any younger person with average politician speaking skills is going to at worst break even with what we have now. But many of us feel we’re already seeing the best Biden can do and it can only get worse as he gets more frustrated and dogged by his deteriorating image.
Totally agree. I think her unfavorables and poor history of building a team make a Whitmer or Newsome nomination more likely but your point about the juxtaposition of old ass trump and someone younger and more vibrant stands and is important.
It makes Whitmer and Newsom more ideal but not more likely. Kamala is still the favorite simply by being VP. If Biden drops out I'd give her a 75% chance of being the nominee even with an open primary. Also I think Kamala would keep the team she has with Biden? Of course it would center around her but one of the reasons for her being the nominee is because she could inherit alot of the Biden/Harris campaign very easily.
Have Kamala go full on prosecutor mode on Trump
And you just know Trump would say something horribly sexist to her because he can't stop himself.
He will just call her nasty and racist. Projection as always.
Then Fox News will call her "shrill" and make veiled jokes about "angry black women". Of course, they'll manage to be equally offensive about anyone without an (R) next to their name so that shouldn't be a deciding factor.
> "I think she (Harris) very well could win overwhelmingly, but before we get into a decision about who else it should be, the president needs to make a decision about whether it's him," Schiff told NBC News on Sunday. It is huge coming from Adam Schiff
She can win in many places but not in the electoral college.
I get the skepticism over Harris. If Biden drops i think there are definitely better choices to replace him. That being said i think there are a number of things people are not really considering when it comes to her unpopularity: 1. First and foremost this is the easiest transition we can make at this point. We can immediately shift to Kamala without a complicated mini primary going into the convention. 2. Yes she was unpopular in past primaries but there really isnt much on her record that can be used against her when going against Trump. The only thing the right has is her heavy hand as a prosecutor which doesnt really work when youre trying to say the dems are soft on crime. 3. There will be an immediate contrast between a quick, intelligent Kamala and both Biden and Trump. 4. She has had some bad moments immediately post roe but the fact that she is a woman may actually help given abortion is basically on the ballot. 5. If there is another debate she will do very well against Trump. 6. She will get to own the best of Bidens record but be able to distinguish herself where necessary. 7. She can pick a Shapiro or Beshear as vp. Kamala is not my first choice and we may very well be screwed either way but I think her past polling and primary performance is not necessarily an indicator of how she will do at the top of the ticket. She will be a huge contrast to Trump and Biden which may be exactly what we need.
>but there really isnt much on her record that can be used against her when going against Trump She has so little on her record as VP, yet her approval ratings have been some of the worst for a VP in recent memory. Her approval rating is worse than it was for Dan Quayle.
Al Gore was in the Senate for 8 years, then VP. He had a record on environment, internet, reducing bureaucracy. Not my favorite politician, but he made sense when he spoke, was calm, and actually answered questions.
As a former climate scientist, I think the greatest tragedy about Gore is that if he was elected, we would have actually had a chance at taking action to mitigate climate change when it still might have made a difference. The damage from that alone is incalculable.
We would not have gone to war in Iraq
He’s talking about her history as a prosecutor
No VP has anything on their record because their only real job is to be the backup President and cast tie breaking votes lol
And she cast more than any other in history
Biden actualky had a pretty strong record
My research showed Quayle had worse ratings, as well as Cheney in his second term.
We are trying to win Wisconsin, rural PA, North Carolina, Michigan, Virginia, NV, and Arizona. If this highly unpopular, female, black/indian, prosecutor had 2 years to make a case to those voters, sure. But she would have 3 months. 3 MONTHS. To convince a bunch of racist, sexist, xenophobic people that’s she’s fine. NO ONE CARES about reddit’s liberal opinions, repeat this to Yourself. They think on a different wavelength than you do. Dems already have NY, Cali, Chicago, Maine, VT, CT, Washington state. We don’t need more of their votes it doesn’t do anything. I repeat, it doesn’t do anything. We’re trying to win over right leaning rural white voters who would rather not have trump. Biden can step down once he wins the election.
Progressives don’t like Harris either. She basically only appeals the to the core of the dem voting base. She’s too woke (and too black and too female) for conservatives or and too ivory tower CA to appeal to rural America. She’s too much of a cop to appeal to progressives so what is her appeal.
Omigod thank you!! These people think Harris is in any way electable have to be the people who think racism is over or isn’t that bad. Not to mention Biden, himself, hurt her image when he stated he would nominate “a woman” for VP. Now she’ll also have to contend with the allegation she’s not “qualified” for the job (highly unfair and untrue, but will absolutely work against her). It’s Biden or bust.
wth Democrats will never win Wyoming, it's not even on the radar for them
I meant Wisconsin, just forgot I said it already.
Everyone is underestimating the effects that misogyny and racism will have on undecided voters
I think a lot of people take those statements and get super defensive, thinking that the people making those statements are basically equating them with open bigots and notorious racists. But it's not like that. Unfortunately even people who are well meaning still carry implicit biases. Even socially conscious people who are aware of inequalities and privilege (what the right refers to as "woke") can still have some internal biases. That's what comes from existing in a society where shit like the Civil Rights Movement in the south and women not being allowed to have bank accounts is still *in living memory*. I consider myself to be a socially conscious person and I still have to stop, think, and examine my internal biases once in a while. I like to think I'm introspective enough to call myself out on those things, but a lot of people can't or won't acknowledge that they have those internal biases even when they consider themselves open minded. We saw it a LOT with Clinton. Plenty of men and women who consider themselves to be respectful of women and are horrified by misogyny still bought into some of the gender bias against her. A lot of the comments about Clinton's unlikability were dog whistles that basically attacked her gender ("shrill", "argumentative", etc.). Things that people wouldn't have even thought about in a male candidate became issues for her. It is very painful for a lot of people to accept that misogyny and racism are still huge factors in our country. It's even more painful for people to accept that they still -- even unconsciously -- perpetuate those things themselves. But it's willful ignorance to say that those things aren't issues.
Mad respect. You basically made the essay I started writing but didn't have the time or energy to finish about this
Those of us in CA know her record as AG and Senator. Three persistent things emerge. 1. She expects things to happen, rather than her putting in a lot of work. 2. Tons of staff people turning over. 3. Speeches that don’t make sense. Those often include the same few phrases that opponents like to mock. Like “unburdened by what has been”
Whoever the replacement is, large portions of the base will be unhappy. We don’t have months and months for infighting
The Dems need to focus WI, MI, PA, and VA. I wish we focused on winning and not hurting feelings
Without reliable data, saying that she is going to win or definitely can't win is useless to the discussion. **Edit** : and as if to prove my point we have dueling replies saying that she is on top of polling and also the least popular VP in recent history.
I mean there’s now pretty ample polling out on Kamala, and unlike for many of the other candidates, it’s somewhat useful since she has very high name recognition & familiarity rates. She’s up on Biden nationally, but a bit weaker in the Rust Belt & Sun Belt states *as of now*. Obviously a ton can change as she actually campaigns, and her VP pick would be a huge deal. Guy who wrote the (new) 538 model gives a good breakdown: https://x.com/gelliottmorris/status/1809675493459071190?s=46
Here's my hypothesis (which are usually wrong). Everyone has gone four years without hearing actual, non-crazy, non-old speech. That it's like an arms race where whoever gets a younger candidate first will shoot up in the polls just from relief and from the vacuum that's existed. So Harris (or whoever) would go up a bit once she gets a spotlight, not decline.
That’s a hunch I have too. The first party to dump their current late 70s + candidate and replace with one a generation (or two) younger will win in a landslide. Hopefully it’s the one that leans toward supporting democracy and popular policies. Since this probably hasn’t been polled, all we have are hunches.
Polls definitely show her as one of the least popular VPs in our lifetimes. >What we do know is that Harris is viewed far more unfavorably than favorably in poll after poll. **Her numbers are lower than her four immediate predecessors at this point in their terms,** though Dan Quayle’s unfavorables were worse. So were Dick Cheney’s in his second term. Harris’ latest favorable rating in the July 1-5 Economist/YouGov poll was 39% of registered voters, while 55% viewed her unfavorable, a 16 percentage point difference. https://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/election/presidential-election/article277246198.html
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But he has it backwards, it only makes sense for Biden to step down if there’s a candidate we can solidly point to as his replacement. And Harris isn’t going to get moderates to come out. Until they have that “clear winner” candidate identified, they need to stop shooting at Biden and hurting our chances in THREE MONTHS. Biden has been old for a while now, if this was really their concern, it should have been brought up years ago, not now. Now we need to rally behind him, because it’s unrealistic to push for a new candidate and win now.
Harris can win IF she comes out FIGHTING. "As a former prosecutor, I WILL NOT allow a rapist, convicted felon to hold the highest office in the land and suppress the rights of women and people of color." No mealy mouthed Soul Of The Nation talk. Attack. Every statement or response to Trump should be about how he diddles kids, and is 30x convicted felon. Her running as a cop before played like a bootlicker to The System at best and a jackboot at worst, but against Trump directly, after his convictions and the Epstein releases, it'll play like Dems are the Law And Order party compared to the criminal anarchy of the right.
This is pretty much the only way I could see Harris winning
I didn't have "Democratic candidate campaigns by leaning into the Thin Blue Line" on my 2024 bingo card, but if it keeps Trump out of office I'll take it.
Any port in a storm, as the saying goes
Exactly... none of this 'when they go low, we go high' bullshit. Sorry, Michelle Obama! When they go low... kick them in the balls. There's a time and place to take the high road, and its *not* when the stakes are this high. I DONT want to see Kamala (if she gets the nomination) take the high road. As you said, come out fighting.
Schiff’s comments, while not exactly a call to drop out, are not holding up the facade that Biden camp would like in the slightest. This may be the most important break so far. It opens the door for senators to take the same position or go further. There is no holding back these waters. Joe, please do this quickly and save yourself the sense that you made the decision that needs to be made!
Wait until after the RNC starting in a week and Trump has to give a live speech in prime time. Don't let anything distract from that. Frame it as Trump is too much of a risk for a candidate that people are unsure of.
Joe's legacy will be tarnished if he loses. He should step aside. Harris isn't my preferred candidate, but she's a magnitude of order better than Biden.
The headline frames it wrong. The real story is that he said that the president needs to decide about his candidacy - which is a door cracked open at saying he should step aside - he went on to say that the path from there could only be unlocked by Biden stepping down and that he felt that if the process led to Kamala then she would win overwhelmingly (again pointing to the idea, without being explicit, that Biden would not.) The real headline is that Schiff just gave permission for senators to take even firmer stances, I think.
More than just cracking the door opened. He told Biden to listen to people "with some distance". This is no longer a wishy washy stand. This is official approval for people to speak out.
If Jeffries makes a statement in the same vein today - floodgates
If Joe steps down, he will cement his legacy as a distinguished public servant and steward of democracy. If he carries forward and loses, he will be a stubborn old man who put his ego first at the great expense to the country.
If Schiff is opening the door on this I expect it'll be a pretty rough week for Team Biden. I'm in favor of Biden dropping out or being pushed out if necessary but my heart does break for him a bit. He seemed so hurt and in denial that this was going to happen during the Stephanopoulos interview, it made me genuinely sad. I still think it needs to happen but I hope he doesn't finish his life feeling betrayed or sad. He did a great job as president and should live on in history as a dedicated public servant. His senior staff on the other hand should be run out of town on a rail for letting this happen. They let him down and they let the country down. This all could have happened a lot cleaner of he hadn't run again.
"His senior staff, on the other hand should be run out of town on a rail for letting this happen." This. Many advisers, staffers, family, media, etc, are complicit here. Where were they? It's not just the future, they let Joe ruin his legacy. This is like a plane crash. Usually, for a plane to crash, multiple things have to go wrong. - Joe should NEVER have run - DNC/family/advisors needed to stop him, and go public. - Joe needed a popular VP who could beat Trump. - Staff needed to be more transparent so the public could slowly digest it instead of dropping a dementia nuke.
I got that vibe too. He's either a brilliant actor, or he's genuinely convinced that he is the best possible solution. The fact that he can't see the truth of the current situation is a bit tragic. I do feel more confident after watching the ABC interview though. It's clear the debate was a low point. The question remains, though - how frequent are these low points, and how fast will he deteriorate?
I don’t like Biden that much but I do know being president was his lifelong dream (his first campaign was in the 80’s) and finally getting that job only to be too old must be soul-crushing plus he probably isn’t even fully cognizant of how far he’s declined most old people aren’t
The fact that a large number of establishment Dems are still talking about Biden stepping aside after his interview where he explicitly said “I’m not leaving Jack” really makes me wonder. I feel the flood gates are going to open when Congress returns tomorrow.
He had to say that no matter what. He can't even hint he is considering leaving until he makes the decision, because there is no coming back - if people hear he is considering leaving, he is finished and has to leave (because why would he consider it, if he is ok?).
I don't think they are brave enough to do it. But I think they should use the convention to do what is technically there for. They should have people nominated to replace Biden on the ticket. They should debate openly. Have votes. Decide on candidate together and then unite under whoever wins in name of saving democracy and moving forward as a country. But that's just a dream. I know not realistic.
Lol I'm beginning to think all politics is just theater for us peons. The Democrats are so laughably out of touch with reality and the Republicans are so fucking obviously evil.
Always has been. Not even a joke. Look at the drama between our very first cabinet. It’s usually a few people bickering about what they think is best and trash talking each other to the public.
The 3rd VP killed Alexander Hamilton in a duel
What I can say, from watching her debate with Pence, is that she would absolutely obliterate Trump in a debate. She would absolutely scorch him when he attempts to interrupt. It would honestly be pretty fire.
I was curious and just watched it 30 mins ago. I forgot how well she did with Pence. I also watched a clip when she debated Biden. Also great. Trump will look like the misogynist he is if he interrupts, talks over, or responds in a disrespectful way.
She better know how to debate if she's a former prosecutor?
I just think its sad that Pete Buttigieg will not get a chance any time soon because he is gay. That is the ONLY reason he won’t get elected. He is an outstanding candidate.
"PoliticsGirl" (Leigh McGowan) has a video called ["Kamala did what?"](https://youtu.be/DJeltMiTZXo) listing how many changes Kamala Harris implemented without nearly getting the media attention of Biden. A few key successes (will add links, if I find any from reputable sources): - Expanding health care coverage to millions of citizens, particularly reproductive rights and maternal healthcare - Increasing the minimum wage by pushing for a raise for all workers on federal projects - Encouraging more union membership in the federal workforce (Union membership is up by 20% since she began) - Supporting Ukraine https://www.reuters.com/world/us-vp-announces-15-billion-aid-ukraine-peace-summit-switzerland-2024-06-15/ - Strengthening relationships with Ghana, Tanzania and Zambia https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/27/world/africa/kamala-harris-visit.html - Visiting Vietnam, Singapore and Japan to strengthen the supply chains for computer chips, reducing the US' dependence on China. https://www.brookings.edu/articles/what-did-kamala-harris-trip-do-for-us-engagement-in-southeast-asia/ - Extending gun control (assault weapon ban, background checks) - Calling out Florida's social studies standards (which DeSantis claimed to not have authored, but chose to defend as "factual" anyway 🤡) as "gaslighting" and "revisionist" for portraying slavery as "beneficial for developing skills" to the enslaved people. https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2023/jul/24/kamala-harris/do-Florida-school-standards-say-enslaved-people/ Further plans: - Expand "Build Back Better" for healthcare, income and housing, if Dems regain congress - Advocacy for debt-free college If all of this is correct, then I'm convinced she's qualified to do his job.
Biden must act now and use the expanded powers of the president ruled by the SCOTUS to detain Trump and the conservative Supreme Court justices in whatever facility has replaced Guantanamo Bay. When their lawyers challenge it, the case will come before the new SCOTUS appointees, at which time the ruling can be fixed/overturned and this miscarriage of democracy can be corrected.
Harris is a huge risk. The potential payoff is huge, but she's a black woman that needs to win over voters in WI, MI, and PA. Would she do better than Biden? I'm skeptical.
We are already going to lose if there is this much division. Unite around a candidate!
> Unite around a candidate! Agree but in this crucial election we need to unite around a candidate who is able to attract Independent voters in Swing States, and that is not Harris. Party unity by itself will not be enough.
> Independent voters in Swing States, and that is not Harris Yep, that's Biden.
The Conservatives have already started to demonize Kamala in preparation for a Biden victory.
Its 3 months from the damn elections. This party does everything in its power to make its supporters regret the two party system. Its 3 fucking months, if you attempt to force out Biden now than you look weak and unorganized. The time to fish for a new candidate was two years ago. It’s honestly regrettable that Republican party is such a shit show that my vote is basically held hostage to this ridiculously out of touch party.
it's 4 months
I’ll take anyone under 60
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The election will be decided by two groups. 1) Independent voters, and 2) pissed off women. The majority of Independents don't like Trump but they're also not high on Biden, especially now. Everyone I speak with is angry that these two are the choices. If those people stay home, Biden is toast. Would they come out and vote for Harris? I think she might have a better chance honestly.
It's imperative we vote for 'not Trump', whoever that is, Biden or Harris.
People who think Kamala has an actual chance at beating Trump are delusional
I don’t but she’s polling within the margin of error at least. Biden isn’t.
It's just bonkers to me that democrats are pushing this. I mean, are you kidding me? Not a snowballs chance in hell she would win against Trump. What planet do these folks live on?
The planet where there wasn't a snowballs chance in hell that Trump would ever be President of the USA.
The Democratic establishment deciding whose turn it is next is how Trump got elected in the first place. Kamala doesn't have wide support and is tied to the Biden administration and his low approval ratings. He did a great job, but the public isn't widely aware of that. We need somebody who the Republican media and their Russian backers aren't prepared for.
I like Kamala, but I don’t think she can win.
In what universe does Harris win?
I love how everyone is clairvoyant, thinking that replacing Biden will result in an automatic win for Democrats. What if he’s replaced and Trump still wins in November? Then the Dems will be screaming that they lost because Biden was replaced.
Gotta say, anyone who seriously thinks Harris can get up onstage and win a crowd is stacking delusion on top of delusion. I've seen her speak and she has the charisma of a discarded tax form. Her only national accomplishment so far is coming near last in the 2020 primaries and she's been sitting on the bench the last 4 years--she's only known for losing, so why is the pick to win possibly the most important election in national history? Look at basically every election in the last century and the more charismatic candidate always wins. Every time we try to pretend this is the one exceptional campaign, it backfires. * In 2000, everyone said it didn't matter that Bush was more charismatic than Gore because who would vote for Bush? * In 2004, everyone said it didn't matter that we were running two East Coast superwealthy lawyers that the public disliked, because who would vote for Bush? * In 2008, everyone said it didn't matter that Obama was drawing huge crowds--Hillary's resume was definitely better so who would vote for Obama? At least we got to out-charisma the Republicans in 2008 and 2012, for a change. Romney was a richer, more obnoxious Kerry--who thought that was a good idea? * 2016, everyone said it didn't matter that charisma was Hillary's dump stat because "it was her turn" and who would vote for Trump anyways? * 2020, we barely managed to squeeze in a low-to-mid charisma candidate (Biden) because Trump had half destroyed America. And even then, we had to leverage Biden's more popular Obama connection very hard. Keep going back before 2000 and the pattern holds. I seriously think that if you were to spin blindfolded on the convention floor, odds are you'd win up pointing at a better candidate. What are we doing? Are we even trying to win anymore?
Do you really think any other democrat candidate has any chance other than Biden at winning the election at this point in the race, honestly? Because I don’t. It’s so funny to me we have all of this “liberal” media saying how much of a disaster he was and calling for his resignation with barely any focus on Trump and his millions of lies on national television when our literal democracy is at stake. Instead I have to hear about a guy being too fucking old when the other guy is literally a facist. Don’t like Biden fine, policy wise if people pay attention which they don’t he’s done a lot, but that doesn’t matter and the media sure as fuck doesn’t talk about that. For these so called liberal and neutral networks they sure have no problem getting conservatives elected must it be a giant coincidence. Fuckin’ all complicit in getting Trump re-elected if he wins. So tired of this shit.
I’d vote for Harris just to see how mad the racist right wingers get when a black woman becomes president. That, and I’m pretty sure she doesn’t wanna be a dictator like Trump does. This is really my main requirement in 2024 from a candidate: do not desire to be a dictator. Pretty simple. Oh and no matter what I’m voting. And no matter what I’m not voting trump. And no matter what I’ll be voting for whoever is most likely to defeat trump. Meaning Green Party no thanks, meaning most likely whoever the official Democratic Party candidate is.
Just make a choice. If Joe can do it, put everything we've got behind him. If it's Kamala, same thing. Democracy is on the line. Though I do think a Whitmer/Shapiro ticket would be exactly what we need.
Kamala would not win. Not a chance. She’s been absolutely faceless as a VP this entire term. If she had been a prominent VP? Maybe. Not as is though.
This country is not going to elect a black woman as POTUS in 2024.
I don't have a problem with Harris but I don't believe for a second she has better chances to win than Biden. She's a brown woman and he's an old white guy: one of those is way more likely to be president than the other. (Don't get me wrong; I don't like that it's like that, but that's still the reality of things)
Biden needs to run.
Kamala probably couldn't win her senate seat back let alone the presidency. Her nomination would be a gift for Trump.
This circular firing squad BS isn’t funny. Put your focus where it should be Congressman, Trump is a rapist and felon who wants to destroy America. Quit talking shit about Biden, if he dies then Harris will step up, until and unless that happens, he’s the nominee.
How could she win “overwhelmingly” when she’s more unpopular than Biden? Schiff seems to live in a fantasy world.
Ok a switch to Kamala would be two steps backward. Maybe even most reviled Dem in national spotlight. Need a clean break from folks in the admin and pick from purple state Dem governors.
>Need a clean break from folks in the admin and pick from purple state Dem governors. This. Poll after poll shows that eligible voters across party lines list two issues as the most important by far: 1) Economy/Cost of Living, and 2) the Immigration Crisis. This has not changed for over a year now and these concerns have to be acknowledged. Democratic opinions are deeply divided on Harris, even ITT. But she will clearly carry the baggage of this administration on these issues. On the other hand, successful governors like Whitmer and Newsom don't carry that baggage, and have extensive experience running a state that Harris does not possess. Also they are both excellent speakers while Harris' word salads are widely lampooned. There are a lot of Democrats who will Vote Blue No Matter Who (and I've always fallen into this category myself). But that is not enough to win over swing state Independents in this election, and we need to win.
Kamal Harris is not winning the election if she is chosen. Where are people come from that they think otherwise
So, they're saying,if Biden steps down, it's Harris's "turn". What happened to electing these fools into their positions? It's nobody's "turn" except for who the American people decide it to be. Right?
> What happened to electing these fools into their positions? The DNC took one look at the dem primary and said "lol no, you're gonna take Biden and you're gonna like it". Dems are so worried about the loss of democracy when it already happened from within their own party
I honestly think Harris is one of the few candidates who would do worse than Joe.
Omg... No she wont... SHE IS NOT EVEN LIKED IN HER HOME STATE! She is a cop who defends qualified immunity for police and backs corporations over unions. This is not the winning ticket. Democrats are overreacting to the debate and propping up the weakest candidate by a mile. Hand Trump his pardon at this point. As another commenter pointed out as well, we don't need the states where Dems poll well. We need the swing states that are filled with sexist, xenophoic, racist peoples who would need way more than 3 months to be potentially sold on Harris.