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Document everything. Everything. This is illegal. And don’t quit. No matter what. What they are doing is illegal. Contact the DOL in your area. They will help you
BCC would still be visible to many with proper credentials. Just fyi.
Many companies will queue outbound emails for review before they leave the company network. They're usually looking for people sending stuff off site. It's part of their infosec stuff.
If they've disabled the USB ports on your company device you may still be able to transfer files with an Android phone. Just plug it in and on the phone set it to file transfer
Mod level IT manager here, yes we can see it but I have never seen a company screen outbound like that. How do you do business without external emails going through? This just doesn't make any sense to me. I have never had any problems with this before
They do go through they're just inspected first. A crafted script, which I affectionately named Mr mcfeely. basically a bot script that would scan the contents of outbound emails looking for keywords, attachments, things like that. if something questionable was detected, it would page somebody on team to look at it manually.
Email leaving the network was scrutinized. Email to the company domains was basically ignored.
This was in place to watch employees that were trying to send documents or whatever. it also would catch them if they were doing personal email with the company domain which was against policy.
In a worst-case scenario, if you get fired, you may want to talk to the U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC). They enforce federal anti-discrimination laws that protect workers from pregnancy discrimination. Here is more from their website: [https://www.eeoc.gov/pregnancy-discrimination](https://www.eeoc.gov/pregnancy-discrimination)
Treat any offer of "help" from HR as you would any snake. They are there to get you fired and unable to sue. Answer only questions asked and in writing if at all possible.
I have been saying this forever and was even banned from antiwork, because of the truth, which is, pregnant women are not welcome in business. Matter of fact, women, in general, are not favored, because they can get pregnant.
Yes, some firms are forward thinking. However, too many are stuck in the 1800s when it comes to women and work in corporate America.
When I was 19, I had a summer job as an office assistant at a small recruiting firm. They literally had “danger of pregnancy” written on women’s paper files. I had to go through old files and contact people. Not for jobs, but to see if they still wanted us to “keep them on file”. LOL. This was over 20 years ago.
I disagree. The problem is with small business if someone takes a preggo leave, small biz will have a hard time finding someone cover for it. On the other hand, your multi-national corp will have no issue finding someone to cover for mat leave
That's such a nonsense reason..lol, the reason their business exists is because a woman gave birth to them. The irony of turning on women is bizarre. And until you're saving babies, your business likely will not suffer. It's just another day, nothing life changing in the world. Put out an ad for a contract role and in this market it will get filled in a day. Pfft.
I was more referring to sexual harassment. It's not really a matter of opinion. I used to work for an occupational safety and health association. Statistically, corporations are much better places to work because they have lower rates of harassment, injuries, etc.
Well, this particular "gender role" is an anatomical inclination, not an imagined construct or non-gender-specific duty
That does not mean that discrimination thereof is not unjust, it just feels inappropriate to call it a "gender role"
Well I disagree, every company has a specific culture to it. Some are more discriminatory than others. The problem is this companies culture views women the wrong way to the point of breaking the law.
Just so I didn’t get hired or offered a spot in a place that gave bad vibes after interviewing, I would mention that was pregnant
Never would hear back from those places
Women can also age and become unf---able. Also more confident and assertive. Definitely a turnoff.
Edit: I'm not saying this is OK. Just that some employers absolutely prefer young eye candy around the office, and it's partly because younger people are often easier to manipulate, don't know their rights, etc. Not-so-young women have usually learned to clock and avoid the office sleazoids.
> most women I know hit their Prime in their 40s
This right here is the problem. Judging women as "being in their prime" or not, while they are doing their jobs.
I'm just saying that it's when they really bloom. In all aspects. For many, all the kids are gone including the husband, and they go through a metamorphic growth stage. They reach true internal adulthood/awareness around this time in life. They become empowered.
I wasn't focused just on their work.
>I'm just saying that it's when they really bloom.
THAT is the problem. You *assessing* them *in the first place*. You thinking that your opinion of their degree of bloomingness is at all relevant. It's not. It's very inappropriate.
Women go to work to do their jobs, not to be assessed for their looks. Full stop.
All the kids are gone when they’re in their 40’s? That would imply they are having kids in their early to mid 20’s. Just FYI but the average age of a first child is now 27.5 in the US. Also, many children don’t leave home now until their mid-20’s.
Well I wouldn't be keen on having to pay for someone to not show up for a fucking year. Not all businesses are Amazon, we don't all have infinite money to burn. If the government is going to mandate it then they should pay your salary. The money just isn't fucking there.
If they are lying to you and documenting for performance, they are trying to fire you quickly. The only solution is to show them that you are not to be trifled with and they will back off. Maybe even ask to speak to HR about this. The more you talk to them about your pregnancy and the process the more protected you will be.
That’s my question! Also I’m “under performing” in not my job, what they have me doing is something super basic that everyone learns but has nothing to do with the role that I signed an offer letter for.
That was going to be my question. Maybe it's just my industry but calling out underperforming after two weeks seems absurd. And even pointing out that she had issues figuring out a program on the first day is even more insane.
Send an email (bcc yourself again) thanking them for the positive verbal feedback. Let them know that to maintain the expectations and surpass the intended goals you'd like the targets to motivate yourself as you want to make sure you don't lose momentum.
I’m sorry, here’s the thing I’m not sure how far along you are but if showing you’d likely not be eligible for FMLA. You need 12 months of employment. Document everything but they may win because you’re on probation and you’re not protected under FMLA. If you can prove they didn’t know and treated you differently then maybe you have a case. Make sure you follow all requested training, get things in writing if you can. Good luck!
I’m 11 weeks but showing early. Most people think I’m having twins because of how big I’ve gotten quickly. I didn’t even know I was pregnant when I applied. I found out right before my third interview. I’m not due until January.
Employment attorney here. With the liklihood you live in once of the 49 at will states, I will be bluntly honest. Short of that explicitly tell you verbally or in writing the reason you are underperforming is due to your pregnancy you have little to no chance of a y attorney taking the case but there is little to no chance if winning. I hate it, it sucks, I fight for it everyday. But short of bombshell evidence otherwise they will terminate you likely in the next few weeks.. Potentially Preventing you from qualifying for benefits.
My advice. Document and turn in everything and anything you can to the state labor board. If you happen to live in a non red state maybe they can help out. But more important start looking for a new job ASAP. And never, ever disclose pregnancy unless you are 1) needing an accommodation or 2) you are filing for FMLA or other benefits.
> And never, ever disclose pregnancy unless you are 1) needing an accommodation or 2) you are filing for FMLA or other benefits.
But then what do you do?? Just tell them a couple weeks before you’re due? That seems like it will wreck your reputation even worse.
I’m in this position, but way further in my pregnancy than OP. I’m more than halfway to my due date, and starting a new job Monday. Not disclosing on my first day feels like screwing myself and the employer because it limits how we can prepare for a (totally unpaid) leave of absence.
It’s a government job, so I’m praying they’re more careful around not discriminating against me than a private corporation would be.
>It’s a government job, so I’m praying they’re more careful around not discriminating against me than a private corporation would be.
Typically government employers are better at this.
What company is expecting you to hit the metrics on day one? I am totally flabbergasted by that. Red flag. Also, if they tell you you are doing great, and write up something different then they are shady as fuck. Red flag. Not disclosing what your targets are. Red flag. Not sure what you can do, but I would keep applying for a different job whilst you work through your issues at this employer. As others said, do not quit. Just hit them with fair questions, document everything and check the employee work book about the correct employee processes to deal with this.
There’s literally a note in my training log saying “unclear if associate is working while at home” because my computer sat idle for less than 15 minutes one day last week. I’m sorry I had to pee, grab a snack, and let my dogs out really quick. The following day in our meeting my supervisor said “wow you put up great numbers yesterday”. 🙄 I wish there was a way I could record these things but we work with health info so no recording allowed (and I get why they have that rule).
Yeah, weird. Did you ask him how the notes and his verbal feedback are not matching up? How can they be unsure if you are working when putting out great numbers at the same time. Also, I would not work for any company that monitors work like that. Its about the output, not how you got there. Red flags all over, start looking for a more mentally healthy employer. You dont need this stress on top of managing your new family.
I have a meeting with my supervisor today so I plan to ask her then and send a follow up email after the meeting. I’m definitely looking again too, it’s just a bummer because it took so long to get this job. I swear I sent out like 60 resumes before I got a call back.
Can you document and compare you performance from two weeks ago to now? It will help you in the future if anything bad comes out of this. I echo the rest of the comments, this is illegal behavior
Do not quit! I can't stand employers like this. They assume if you are pregnant that you're no longer an asset. Document everything.. You can also search for an employment lawyer in your area that offers a free consult. Contact the Department of Labor in your area too. This is unacceptable.
That is absolutely insane. I hope your baby is protected because you don't need this kind of stress. Good luck but second everything everyone says, get a lawyer asap.
Well you know it’s illegal for them to do anything, but of course their opinion of you changed if you’ve just started and you arrive to your first day visibly pregnant.
Just continue doing your best until your great work can make up for that bad first impression
discrimination on the basis of pregnancy, childbirth, or related medical conditions is a type of unlawful sex discrimination. As a woman, you would surely appreciate that. She didnt trick anyone.
ofc they should, they should just mention it and be honest while interviewing instead of scamming the team for shitloads of money while they’re out for a year with a brat they planned to have
i hate women bc i don’t want them to lie ab pregnancy and then get paid for 38 weeks of maternity leave while they’re doing nothing for the company? yeah alright girl
I’m literally a woman you fucking moron what i have to agree with all of you just bc girls support girls? i can’t have my own opinion because I’m a woman?
It doesn't matter, I of course assume you won't risk having children while in a type of employment that could let you go, and leave you in need of a new job.
if not having a job for a month or two means you’re not gna be able to pay your bills and get kicked out on the street then you really are in no position to have children are you
I asked the internet so the 1 random angry person shouldn’t be a surprise. You’re entitled to your own opinion I guess but let’s set a few things straight.
1) As I’ve stated in previous comments, I didn’t know I was pregnant when I applied.
2) The reason I was even looking in the first place is the company I was working for lost the contract I was employed under and there was nowhere for them to put me. I got a small bit of “severance” and got to work looking for work.
3) My main reason for working is healthcare. My husband owns his business and does fairly well, but private insurance for the 2 of us (soon to be 3) was a drain on our resources every month (about $1200 per month +copays/prescription costs) which is why we decided that I would work. The tiny amount of income I have after paying for insurance goes into a savings account.
4) This is maybe a step or two above entry level job paying less than $16/hour, obviously I want to keep it but this multi-national company isn’t going to go under when I take my 5 days of Mat Leave in January that they offer associates who have worked there less than a year (6 weeks if you’ve been there a year). I’m not sure where you are but I’d LOVE 38 weeks of Mat Leave.
5) I’m a 30 year old woman who wants kids and enjoys sleeping with her husband, when do you suggest I procreate?
if you can’t afford it then i suggest you never procreate … you really wanna have kids who’s parents are always at work and constantly stressing about bills? stop being so fucking selfish and making people live in poverty just bc you want to feel fulfilled by having kids
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Send all questions in email about what you can do so you can physically document as much as you possibly can
Document everything. Everything. This is illegal. And don’t quit. No matter what. What they are doing is illegal. Contact the DOL in your area. They will help you
BCC everything to your personal email in case you get locked out of your email as well, OP.
BCC would still be visible to many with proper credentials. Just fyi. Many companies will queue outbound emails for review before they leave the company network. They're usually looking for people sending stuff off site. It's part of their infosec stuff.
Then print it. Either physically, or to a PDF file stored somewhere you have control of - personal cloud storage or USB drive.
Or take photos of the screen with your phone.
If they've disabled the USB ports on your company device you may still be able to transfer files with an Android phone. Just plug it in and on the phone set it to file transfer
In most environments if we plug something into a company computer alarms go off at the it desk just so you know.
So you're at the extreme end of workplace computer security, then. I've never worked at a place that was locked down that tight
Mod level IT manager here, yes we can see it but I have never seen a company screen outbound like that. How do you do business without external emails going through? This just doesn't make any sense to me. I have never had any problems with this before
They do go through they're just inspected first. A crafted script, which I affectionately named Mr mcfeely. basically a bot script that would scan the contents of outbound emails looking for keywords, attachments, things like that. if something questionable was detected, it would page somebody on team to look at it manually. Email leaving the network was scrutinized. Email to the company domains was basically ignored. This was in place to watch employees that were trying to send documents or whatever. it also would catch them if they were doing personal email with the company domain which was against policy.
Print it out or screenshot it, but do not BCC it, as that's traceable by your IT team.
In a worst-case scenario, if you get fired, you may want to talk to the U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC). They enforce federal anti-discrimination laws that protect workers from pregnancy discrimination. Here is more from their website: [https://www.eeoc.gov/pregnancy-discrimination](https://www.eeoc.gov/pregnancy-discrimination)
Treat any offer of "help" from HR as you would any snake. They are there to get you fired and unable to sue. Answer only questions asked and in writing if at all possible.
I have been saying this forever and was even banned from antiwork, because of the truth, which is, pregnant women are not welcome in business. Matter of fact, women, in general, are not favored, because they can get pregnant. Yes, some firms are forward thinking. However, too many are stuck in the 1800s when it comes to women and work in corporate America.
When I was 19, I had a summer job as an office assistant at a small recruiting firm. They literally had “danger of pregnancy” written on women’s paper files. I had to go through old files and contact people. Not for jobs, but to see if they still wanted us to “keep them on file”. LOL. This was over 20 years ago.
I believe it. Businesses are super unethical by default
Sadly gender roles are still pretty prevalent in certain corporations eyes.
There's waaaay more sexism running rampant in small businesses.
I disagree. The problem is with small business if someone takes a preggo leave, small biz will have a hard time finding someone cover for it. On the other hand, your multi-national corp will have no issue finding someone to cover for mat leave
That's such a nonsense reason..lol, the reason their business exists is because a woman gave birth to them. The irony of turning on women is bizarre. And until you're saving babies, your business likely will not suffer. It's just another day, nothing life changing in the world. Put out an ad for a contract role and in this market it will get filled in a day. Pfft.
>the reason their business exists is because a woman gave birth to them Are you saying that only women can give birth?
Unless you are one of 10 people doing the same role it’s little different filling pregnancy leave in a big company in my experience.
I was more referring to sexual harassment. It's not really a matter of opinion. I used to work for an occupational safety and health association. Statistically, corporations are much better places to work because they have lower rates of harassment, injuries, etc.
It's all the numbers game. A pregnancy takes worker away from job for extended period. So, it's pretty much avoided.
Well, this particular "gender role" is an anatomical inclination, not an imagined construct or non-gender-specific duty That does not mean that discrimination thereof is not unjust, it just feels inappropriate to call it a "gender role"
Well I disagree, every company has a specific culture to it. Some are more discriminatory than others. The problem is this companies culture views women the wrong way to the point of breaking the law.
Just so I didn’t get hired or offered a spot in a place that gave bad vibes after interviewing, I would mention that was pregnant Never would hear back from those places
Wait, you got banned from antiwork for this...? This seems right up their alley?
Antiwork isn't really about worker's rights anymore. It's just one big circlejerk from people who genuinely just don't want to work at all
Bingo
Women can also age and become unf---able. Also more confident and assertive. Definitely a turnoff. Edit: I'm not saying this is OK. Just that some employers absolutely prefer young eye candy around the office, and it's partly because younger people are often easier to manipulate, don't know their rights, etc. Not-so-young women have usually learned to clock and avoid the office sleazoids.
Wow, most women I know hit their Prime in their 40s maybe you're talking about people much older than retirement age?
> most women I know hit their Prime in their 40s This right here is the problem. Judging women as "being in their prime" or not, while they are doing their jobs.
I'm just saying that it's when they really bloom. In all aspects. For many, all the kids are gone including the husband, and they go through a metamorphic growth stage. They reach true internal adulthood/awareness around this time in life. They become empowered. I wasn't focused just on their work.
>I'm just saying that it's when they really bloom. THAT is the problem. You *assessing* them *in the first place*. You thinking that your opinion of their degree of bloomingness is at all relevant. It's not. It's very inappropriate. Women go to work to do their jobs, not to be assessed for their looks. Full stop.
All the kids are gone when they’re in their 40’s? That would imply they are having kids in their early to mid 20’s. Just FYI but the average age of a first child is now 27.5 in the US. Also, many children don’t leave home now until their mid-20’s.
It’s true. I’m a dentist and it’s hard finding good assistants because many times they’re young and they get pregnant and need to leave. I get it.
Well I wouldn't be keen on having to pay for someone to not show up for a fucking year. Not all businesses are Amazon, we don't all have infinite money to burn. If the government is going to mandate it then they should pay your salary. The money just isn't fucking there.
Which is what I was attempting to explain at antiwork, but they would have none of it.
Honestly if they had their way the only businesses in existence would be the monopolies on government welfare.
If they are lying to you and documenting for performance, they are trying to fire you quickly. The only solution is to show them that you are not to be trifled with and they will back off. Maybe even ask to speak to HR about this. The more you talk to them about your pregnancy and the process the more protected you will be.
Also how the hell is someone underperforming after 2 weeks.........that is straight up discrimination.
That’s my question! Also I’m “under performing” in not my job, what they have me doing is something super basic that everyone learns but has nothing to do with the role that I signed an offer letter for.
That’s ludicrous smh, good luck
That was going to be my question. Maybe it's just my industry but calling out underperforming after two weeks seems absurd. And even pointing out that she had issues figuring out a program on the first day is even more insane.
Send an email (bcc yourself again) thanking them for the positive verbal feedback. Let them know that to maintain the expectations and surpass the intended goals you'd like the targets to motivate yourself as you want to make sure you don't lose momentum.
I’m sorry, here’s the thing I’m not sure how far along you are but if showing you’d likely not be eligible for FMLA. You need 12 months of employment. Document everything but they may win because you’re on probation and you’re not protected under FMLA. If you can prove they didn’t know and treated you differently then maybe you have a case. Make sure you follow all requested training, get things in writing if you can. Good luck!
I’m 11 weeks but showing early. Most people think I’m having twins because of how big I’ve gotten quickly. I didn’t even know I was pregnant when I applied. I found out right before my third interview. I’m not due until January.
Start contacting employment lawyers!
Employment attorney here. With the liklihood you live in once of the 49 at will states, I will be bluntly honest. Short of that explicitly tell you verbally or in writing the reason you are underperforming is due to your pregnancy you have little to no chance of a y attorney taking the case but there is little to no chance if winning. I hate it, it sucks, I fight for it everyday. But short of bombshell evidence otherwise they will terminate you likely in the next few weeks.. Potentially Preventing you from qualifying for benefits. My advice. Document and turn in everything and anything you can to the state labor board. If you happen to live in a non red state maybe they can help out. But more important start looking for a new job ASAP. And never, ever disclose pregnancy unless you are 1) needing an accommodation or 2) you are filing for FMLA or other benefits.
Especially on the first day, to one’s supervisor AND their boss.
> And never, ever disclose pregnancy unless you are 1) needing an accommodation or 2) you are filing for FMLA or other benefits. But then what do you do?? Just tell them a couple weeks before you’re due? That seems like it will wreck your reputation even worse. I’m in this position, but way further in my pregnancy than OP. I’m more than halfway to my due date, and starting a new job Monday. Not disclosing on my first day feels like screwing myself and the employer because it limits how we can prepare for a (totally unpaid) leave of absence. It’s a government job, so I’m praying they’re more careful around not discriminating against me than a private corporation would be.
>It’s a government job, so I’m praying they’re more careful around not discriminating against me than a private corporation would be. Typically government employers are better at this.
What company is expecting you to hit the metrics on day one? I am totally flabbergasted by that. Red flag. Also, if they tell you you are doing great, and write up something different then they are shady as fuck. Red flag. Not disclosing what your targets are. Red flag. Not sure what you can do, but I would keep applying for a different job whilst you work through your issues at this employer. As others said, do not quit. Just hit them with fair questions, document everything and check the employee work book about the correct employee processes to deal with this.
There’s literally a note in my training log saying “unclear if associate is working while at home” because my computer sat idle for less than 15 minutes one day last week. I’m sorry I had to pee, grab a snack, and let my dogs out really quick. The following day in our meeting my supervisor said “wow you put up great numbers yesterday”. 🙄 I wish there was a way I could record these things but we work with health info so no recording allowed (and I get why they have that rule).
Yeah, weird. Did you ask him how the notes and his verbal feedback are not matching up? How can they be unsure if you are working when putting out great numbers at the same time. Also, I would not work for any company that monitors work like that. Its about the output, not how you got there. Red flags all over, start looking for a more mentally healthy employer. You dont need this stress on top of managing your new family.
I have a meeting with my supervisor today so I plan to ask her then and send a follow up email after the meeting. I’m definitely looking again too, it’s just a bummer because it took so long to get this job. I swear I sent out like 60 resumes before I got a call back.
After the meeting kindly sent him the .meeting minutes and tell him to feel free to ad anything that he thinks is worth noting from the meeting.
Can you document and compare you performance from two weeks ago to now? It will help you in the future if anything bad comes out of this. I echo the rest of the comments, this is illegal behavior
Do not quit! I can't stand employers like this. They assume if you are pregnant that you're no longer an asset. Document everything.. You can also search for an employment lawyer in your area that offers a free consult. Contact the Department of Labor in your area too. This is unacceptable.
Never tell anyone at work that you’re pregnant.
Kinda hard to avoid if you're visibly pregnant. I mean, I guess you could say inhave a benign growth.
I’d say bad gas.
That is absolutely insane. I hope your baby is protected because you don't need this kind of stress. Good luck but second everything everyone says, get a lawyer asap.
[удалено]
No. The main motivation for me when I applied was that I needed a job.
Well you know it’s illegal for them to do anything, but of course their opinion of you changed if you’ve just started and you arrive to your first day visibly pregnant. Just continue doing your best until your great work can make up for that bad first impression
EEOC lawyers salivating rn Seriously, this is a MASSIVE legal problem in the making for your company, so long as you get documentation.
so you tricked them into hiring you even with your pregnancy and now you’re mad that they’re fighting back? next time procreate on someone else’s dime
discrimination on the basis of pregnancy, childbirth, or related medical conditions is a type of unlawful sex discrimination. As a woman, you would surely appreciate that. She didnt trick anyone.
i don’t give a fuck
You have some anger issues you might want to see a doctor for.
Oh yeah. Forgot pregnant women don’t need money to live.
should have thought of that one before planning to have children then? this one clearly wasn’t an accident
Do you think pregnant women shouldn’t be allowed to get a new job at all? That’s incredibly fucking dumb.
ofc they should, they should just mention it and be honest while interviewing instead of scamming the team for shitloads of money while they’re out for a year with a brat they planned to have
lol. Scamming for shitloads of money. Yes maternity leave is notoriously ‘shitloads of money’. Just admit you hate women mate.
i hate women bc i don’t want them to lie ab pregnancy and then get paid for 38 weeks of maternity leave while they’re doing nothing for the company? yeah alright girl
You’re deluded.
Companies don’t offer maternity leave. You have to use vacation and sick days and sometimes go on short term disability.
Just terrible, I'm very glad you will never face such a grueling choice yourself.
I’m literally a woman you fucking moron what i have to agree with all of you just bc girls support girls? i can’t have my own opinion because I’m a woman?
It doesn't matter, I of course assume you won't risk having children while in a type of employment that could let you go, and leave you in need of a new job.
if not having a job for a month or two means you’re not gna be able to pay your bills and get kicked out on the street then you really are in no position to have children are you
A month or two or nine + maternity leave + employers being put off by your new parent status, but I guess we're splitting hairs.
so just don’t have fucking kids? if it’s such a burden to you then don’t? literally who is forcing you
I asked the internet so the 1 random angry person shouldn’t be a surprise. You’re entitled to your own opinion I guess but let’s set a few things straight. 1) As I’ve stated in previous comments, I didn’t know I was pregnant when I applied. 2) The reason I was even looking in the first place is the company I was working for lost the contract I was employed under and there was nowhere for them to put me. I got a small bit of “severance” and got to work looking for work. 3) My main reason for working is healthcare. My husband owns his business and does fairly well, but private insurance for the 2 of us (soon to be 3) was a drain on our resources every month (about $1200 per month +copays/prescription costs) which is why we decided that I would work. The tiny amount of income I have after paying for insurance goes into a savings account. 4) This is maybe a step or two above entry level job paying less than $16/hour, obviously I want to keep it but this multi-national company isn’t going to go under when I take my 5 days of Mat Leave in January that they offer associates who have worked there less than a year (6 weeks if you’ve been there a year). I’m not sure where you are but I’d LOVE 38 weeks of Mat Leave. 5) I’m a 30 year old woman who wants kids and enjoys sleeping with her husband, when do you suggest I procreate?
if you can’t afford it then i suggest you never procreate … you really wanna have kids who’s parents are always at work and constantly stressing about bills? stop being so fucking selfish and making people live in poverty just bc you want to feel fulfilled by having kids