You don’t have to like BoP but you can’t deny how much of an achievement this is. To put it into perspective: in 1987 the #17 rothmans Porsche finished 20 LAPS AHEAD OF THE 2ND PLACE CAR. 20 laps behind in 2024 is where the COOL racing LMP2 finished.
Also (not a knock at all) but BOP, spec parts, and lower HP levels really improves reliability of the cars, as OEMs are not rewarded for pushing the envelope in the quest to innovate find more speed.
I think I was great that Hyper car was really competitive but coverage really did seem to focus too much on them and not the LMP2 or GT3 races, which was a bit of a loss if you ask me.
Yes because they also cut randomly to slow motion replays and cut away from interesting battles for the lead to show a car pulling out of the pits. Those filler shots have a place but TV direction this year did not make much sense
i know, it drives me mental when they cut to a fuel-guy in the garage or a social media manager whilst there’s two cars tussling.
i didn’t think it was that bad this year though, they do it every year.
When the winning Ferrari exits the final Ford chicane and turns towards the checkered flag, and the goddamn TV-director cuts to a random Ferrari-mechanic sitting in the garage, and then cuts to a *much worse* camera-angle where the checkered flag is in view but the Ferrari isn't yet.
Ffs they could've just stuck to the same camera pointed at the Ferrari when it exited the Ford chicane and it would've looked real good. That camera would've seen both the Ferrari and checkered flag from a decent angle with better lighting.
“random Ferarri-mechanic” Brotherman those were the two other drivers of the winning car, I think it’s appropriate to include them in their own win but idk maybe that’s just me
There was like an hour long battle for the LMGT3 lead starting well before the last rain hit and continuing through the beginning of it that was between the leading #91 Porsche and the trailing #31 BMW. During this battle they were never more than 2 seconds apart on track. I had to follow that battle through the live timing screen, because the only TV coverage that battle got was when the #91 took the lead back from the #31. We got to see it in a replay, about 15 minutes after the overtake actually happened.
This might shock you but the GTs have global OEMs and incredible fights, too.
The multi class aspect is a big part of what makes Le Mans and endurance racing special, which makes it sad to see them largely ignored.
Plus you can acknowledge a great race and still criticize the broadcast, you know. Those are seperate things.
Yeah and this era won't last forever
Sooner or later GTs will have their limelight again but GT fans cannot seem to accept that and want 100% coverage now
The coverage of the other classes was shocking ltbh, I can maybe understand th LMP2, but GT3 was barely any better. As someone drifting in an out across the 24 hours I really had no idea which car was leading in the class at multiple times right up to the end
The coverage of LMP2 was a lot better towards the end of the race, although the fact that we had about 6 laps of a battle for second where neither car stayed on track for more than 30 saeconds probably helped!
The Jota crew deserve a big shout-out. Building up the #12 from a bare chassis in 24 hours, a process for which their previous best was 3 weeks, to running in the top 10 most of the race and finishing on the lead lap. The mechanics deserve to sleep for a week after this weekend.
Safety car definitely played a major role, however no denying that the field was really close on performance anyway.
Too bad that due to 7 hours of SC (also a record, shameful one) and rainy conditions, only 311 laps were completed by the winner and the following 8 cars. Smallest completed distance by the overall winner in this century and second worst one since 1995, when race-winning McLaren went under 300 laps.
Yes, source is: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024\_24\_Hours\_of\_Le\_Mans#Race\_results](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_24_Hours_of_Le_Mans#Race_results)
Official source can be found here: [https://www.fiawec.com/en/race/result/4865](https://www.fiawec.com/en/race/result/4865)
Will be interesting to see what they do with the SC rules next year. At the moment, you could make a case for optimising your car to be fastest in the last 4 hours - so long as you stay on the lead lap, that'll be when the race is won and lost.
If #8 hadn't had the wheelnut issue, it wouldn't have been in a position to get punted by the #51.
Cadillac was relying on a gamble scenario that unfortunately never came.
They made the right play, if they didnt gamble they probably would finish in this spot anyway but luck didnt arrive
Cadillac & Porsche (and everyone else) never really had the pace/BOP to compete with Ferrari or Toyota. It is kind of the same story as last year, though the BOP was better this year
I dont think pace was an issue at that stage, Cadillac was pulling great laps during their gamble and couldve been in a winning position if the race played out how they wanted it
I love how extremely competitive it was this year, although I am truly salty about the result.
Last year there was no dirty business going on and Toyota had a combination of mistakes and bad luck, and I was so pleased with Ferrari winning. This year it seems like everyone was ignoring all of Ferrari's BS all race. Be it the unsafe release, spraying oil messing up the number 7's vision, or the number 8 being punted. Ferrari was either getting ignored or getting a slap on the wrist by the stewards/race control. I'm happy for the #50 Ferrari drivers, but holy fuck were we robbed. It's true that Pechito shat the bed and spun, but alas, I'm quite upset.
This stings a lot and seeing the sheer amount of shit being thrown at us online (mainly Instagram) by Ferrari and Porsche fans is batshit insane. Toyota needs a 3rd car, stat.
Downvote away now.
You weren't robbed, if Lopez doesn't spin in the last hour, and there isn't the issue with the wheel at the pit stop then the Toyota probably wins.
Not saying Ferrari didn't get the rub of the green with a couple of decisions, but Toyota lost the race with the mistakes they made!
If you’re putting your fate in the hands of JML over Kobayashi……WHEN HISTORICALLY YOU ALWAYS END WITH THE JAPANESE DRIVER OF EACH CAR….what do you expect to happen?
There’s a reason they demoted JML & that last hour showcased that. The two slip ups at Dunlop and coming off of the Mulsanne sunk him
You could also say that if it rained a but less in the final 90 minutes, Ferrari need an extra pitstop. No matter who wins, there are a list of "if this one thing was different, the other car wins"
Sure, then I say "If the ACO had made them fix the door a lap earlier" or "if the GT3 hadn't spun bringing out a slow zone" or "if the caddy hadn't gotten back on track after their crash" or "if the 7 hadn't spun in quali or had the punctures" or I can talk about the wheel nut
The punctures and weather were out of Toyota’s control. Sure, the spin wasn’t, but there’s no guarantee he would’ve fought for the win without the win. Likewise, that’s a mistake, it’s not a bad call from the officials. Bad calls aren’t ifs buts and maybes like a mistake is, they’re something that shouldn’t happen. There’s a big difference, and that’s why people are upset.
Which decisions are consistent with what decisions?
Waiting half a stint to get the Ferrari to pit with an open door? Oh, that’d be consistent with Proton in Spa where they were given 3 laps (equivalent to 1.5 Le Mans laps).
The decision not to have Ferrari pit to fix their broken rain light? Oh, that’s similar to telling Toyota to put and fix it in Spa 2023 (or maybe 2022 can’t remember the year) and ruining their race.
The decision to only reprimand Ferrari for exceeding their energy usages? Sounds exactly like how the DSQed Peugeot for the same thing in Le Mans.
The decision to give a 5s penalty after the #51 took out the lead Toyota? That’s consistent with every other race ruining incident which usually lands a 30s drive through.
The decision not to penalise the unsafe pit release of the #50 car? That’s the same as every other unsafe pit release landing a 10s penalty.
Mate, they made plenty of bad calls that weren’t consistent with anything. You’re lying through your teeth if you claim otherwise. Treat any one of them properly, and the #50 car doesn’t win and the #51 car doesn’t get a podium.
Yeah absolutely, but I still wouldn't define that as being robbed.
If Toyota had ran a completely perfect race, made zero mistakes, and then lost due to debatable calls from the stewards/incidents on tracks, then you could say they were robbed.
But they made a number of errors during the last two hours that cost them. If they hadn't they would have won.
Biggest bullshit I have ever read.
Ferrari made loads of mistakes but only get the win because of the stewards. If Ferrari had delivered a flawless race I would agree with you. But not a single decision was made in favour of toyota.
even the red flag in Q is a bit exaggerated.
So clearly robbed.
First off, you can calm down mate. It's just a load of cars driving round a piece of tarmac 😂😂
They were not clearly robbed, I agree Ferrari made mistakes as well, pretty much every team did. Which is almost exactly my point, no one ran a flawless race, no one really had a clear pace advantage over the whole race, so no one really got robbed.
I already agreed Ferrari probably got the benefit of a couple of decisions, but it's racing, sometimes that happens.
Sure, should calm down, but imagine working the whole year to win this race. Which, by the way, is much more than a few cars driving in circles.
You're at the track for 16 hours every day for 11 days and awake for 42 hours on race day. Then another team comes and drives the leading car out of the race. And in the same team, a "not roadworthy" car with a non-functioning door and without complete headlights drives in the rain. A roll over without a working door, unimaginable. But Ferrari is allowed to continue. Toyota has to pit within 2 laps due to a sensor wobble.
The race was not decided on the track and that's robbed.
And the first statement from the Ferrari CEO: Teamwork makes the dream work.
Especially when some decisions are signed with the same name as the main sponsor on the red cars. Coincidence.
Wow...
Mate I get it, it must be supremely frustrating! I just feel you're looking too much on things Toyota can't control, rather than what they can.
The car wasn't completely reliable, the engine had issues twice in the last couple of hours. There was the wheel nut issue in the last couple of hours, Lopez spun at Dunlop, went wide at Mulsanne. If you don't have those issues/make those mistakes, you most likely win the race!
Yes, of course. But if you won the race, if the right decisions and penalties had been given, then everything would be ok.
But since you don't win due to wrong decisions and penalties on the part of the organization and someone else "gets" the victory, it's robbed.
Nobody can expect a car to perform in such a way that wrong decisions are simply made good.
What's more, if the Lexus had pushed away the #50 shortly before the end, it would have been 100% robbed.
So why can a team resort to unfair means? It was 100% not a racing accident, he wasn't even on the racing line.
Mate there's nothing more for me to say. As a complete neutral I in no way came away from that race thinking anyone was robbed.
Respectfully both yourself and a number of other Ferrari/Toyota fans came away with wildly different opinions as they have emotional bias to their teams which are preventing a balanced view of the race.
It's just slightly ironic that before the race your Sporting Director was claiming that if other teams had lost the race they would have done a bad job, but now that Toyota lost, it's everyone else's fault but their own! 😂
Good luck at Interlagos!
Firstly your definition of flying down the outside like a maniac is a bit off. It was an overly ambitious move, but they are racing, sometimes that happens.
Secondly the 8 lost about 40 seconds in that incident, and finished over a minute behind the leader.
I’m a Porsche fan. Nearly all Porsche fans I’ve seen are pissed off as well. After the LMP1 era, I don’t think I’d ever say this but I was supporting Toyota just to see Ferrari not win, and most Porsche fans seemed to have been in the same boat. Likewise, the #6 should’ve been on that podium, not Osama bin Guidi. It’s just all of the tifosi coming over from F1 for this one race. Look at their profiles, highly active in F1 subs, but other then Le Mans they haven’t touched the WEC before. Thankfully we don’t have to deal with their shit come the next race, and at least karma is going to keep reaming them in F1.
Firstly, I didn’t mention anything about last year, I’m only talking about the unfair decisions made by the FIA that objectively helped Ferrari win.
Also, Toyota was more or less expected to dominate last year, at least for the start of the season. They’ve had been racing that car for 2 years prior to 2023, and they had a decade of racing top class prototypes before the GR010. They already knew how to maximise performance from their car before the start of 2023. The other teams didn’t, and Ferrari hadn’t even raced prototypes for over half a century. If somehow the BoP was perfect from race 1 (hard to do since the FIA wouldn’t have had the proper data), then you’d expect Toyota to run away due to being able to get more out of the car with their set ups. Yet Ferrari was immediately able to challenge Toyota? Then in Le Mans they were able to comfortably run away. Suggests they had a bit of a BoP advantage. So I’m not sure complaining about performances last year is what you want to be doing.
Same with this year, excluding Qatar, they’ve been the clear fastest car and had a BoP advantage, including Le Mans. Porsche benefited in the 1st race, but since then Ferrari has been, they’ve just been to sh*t of a team to actually take advantage of it in Imola and Spa, and they even nearly screwed it up in Le Mans. They didn’t deserve to win, if they had been BoPed properly they wouldn’t have been on the lead lap with all of their issues this year.
Regardless, this isn’t about the BoP which can be a simple mistake, it’s about the countless bad calls by the FIA which ended up helping Ferrari go win. It adds insult to injury and shouldn’t be happening.
Lots of things cost them the win. Yes, some of those things were in Toyota’s control and without them they would’ve won. But most of them weren’t, and many of them shouldn’t happen. Something like the weather ruining a race isn’t in someone’s control, but it can happen. Something like the stewards giving favourable calls shouldn’t happen though, which is what people are upset about. If the stewards were fair, Ferrari wouldn’t have won.
Also, don’t forget that Ferrari made a lot more mistakes that should’ve cost them the win. If Toyota did win, there’s a lot within their control that they could’ve done differently that would give them the win.
I think the release of the 50 wasn’t that bad, but the 51 should have been penalized a lot heavier. 50 wouldn’t have made it if a meatball was shown earlier though.
But just like last year, Toyota once again made the wrong final driver choice: they would have won both if they didn’t went with their second (or even third) best driver (or last year the one with the least experience) for the last stint.
> spraying oil messing up the number 7's vision
wasn't the oil spray first reported by Cadillac at the start of the race, so it wasn't just affecting Toyota (wouldn't that be a technical error?)
>This stings a lot and seeing the sheer amount of shit being thrown at us online (mainly Instagram) by Ferrari and Porsche fans is batshit insane.
WECcirclejerk being one of them
Don't know why I would downvote. I have been rooting for #6 Porsche since the start of last year but this is just a very balanced take.
I also would've preferred if Toyota won instead of Ferrari but there's always next year I guess
Dude you arent wrong to feel like this.
Ferrari got away with a lot.
- Blown headlight on 50 - cars got DQ'd for this as its in the rules
- 5secs for spinning out the leader
- Leaky Ferrari basically spraying everyone behind. Caddy and the #7 got the worst of it.
- at one point the stewards were investigating both Ferrari's for a major technical infringement but that disappeared as soon as it came lol
Whan an effin joke. You would be a fool, someone ignorant or an Italian teenager with the English vocabulary of only the word"cry" in their arsenal to think the rules weren't bent for Ferrari
It never said major technical infringement tho. They were reprimanded for it, which happens a decent amount. Not all technical infringements are DSQ worthy
Just to add, that technical infringement was for using too much energy in their stint. They got a reprimand for it, meanwhile Peugeot got DSQed for the same thing in Qatar.
Honestly, last year was already kinda iffy with the huge BoP break Ferrari had, where FIA had to change their own rule just to slow the Toyota down. But it was undeniable that Ferrari had a (Mostly) clean race and was on it.
This year's is just sour and feel undeserved.
At the start of the race I was rooting for Ferrari, at the end I wanted Toyota to win and I feel exactly like you. That was only fair.
I don't understand BOP, but I would guess there is also sometimes crooked going on.
This race was a big win for the sport in terms of regulations.
I can’t say it was really entertaining (maybe I’m just a salty Porsche fan) I can’t recall any real great battles or truly critical moments. I guess part of it is the nature of a race this long (and racing in general in many cases) a very large portion of this race was won and lost in the pits.
Also can we talk about how incredibly reliable pretty much every hypercar was (lol Alpine)!?
You don’t have to like BoP but you can’t deny how much of an achievement this is. To put it into perspective: in 1987 the #17 rothmans Porsche finished 20 LAPS AHEAD OF THE 2ND PLACE CAR. 20 laps behind in 2024 is where the COOL racing LMP2 finished.
Damn, that’s some pretty cool perspective!
Also (not a knock at all) but BOP, spec parts, and lower HP levels really improves reliability of the cars, as OEMs are not rewarded for pushing the envelope in the quest to innovate find more speed.
Except for Alpine?
Correct
Imagine if the Whelen Cadillac won with 311 laps completed.
[удалено]
Yes. That's the point lol
I think I was great that Hyper car was really competitive but coverage really did seem to focus too much on them and not the LMP2 or GT3 races, which was a bit of a loss if you ask me.
When the restart happened it took 1 Hour for them to show the other classes. Not even an exaggeration.
we had some of the most mind bogglingly incredible fights going on between three global titans of OEM’s and you’re actually complaining
Yes because they also cut randomly to slow motion replays and cut away from interesting battles for the lead to show a car pulling out of the pits. Those filler shots have a place but TV direction this year did not make much sense
i know, it drives me mental when they cut to a fuel-guy in the garage or a social media manager whilst there’s two cars tussling. i didn’t think it was that bad this year though, they do it every year.
When the winning Ferrari exits the final Ford chicane and turns towards the checkered flag, and the goddamn TV-director cuts to a random Ferrari-mechanic sitting in the garage, and then cuts to a *much worse* camera-angle where the checkered flag is in view but the Ferrari isn't yet. Ffs they could've just stuck to the same camera pointed at the Ferrari when it exited the Ford chicane and it would've looked real good. That camera would've seen both the Ferrari and checkered flag from a decent angle with better lighting.
“random Ferarri-mechanic” Brotherman those were the two other drivers of the winning car, I think it’s appropriate to include them in their own win but idk maybe that’s just me
Some of us enjoy seeing the battles in GT3 too
There was a really good battle between the lexus, bmw, and Ford that they didn't even show.
There was like an hour long battle for the LMGT3 lead starting well before the last rain hit and continuing through the beginning of it that was between the leading #91 Porsche and the trailing #31 BMW. During this battle they were never more than 2 seconds apart on track. I had to follow that battle through the live timing screen, because the only TV coverage that battle got was when the #91 took the lead back from the #31. We got to see it in a replay, about 15 minutes after the overtake actually happened.
May be they need to have two separate feeds available from next year
That or something like F1 TV where you can select onboards to get the feed from when you want. That would be cool without needing more commentators
There were so many onboard channels from hypercar and GT3 on Youtube and WEC TV, my German internet couldnt even handle.
Was there a way to pick and choose? Watching in the US via Max I couldn’t
FIA WEC app
Ah, gotcha thanks
I had to use YouTube for onboard views. Most were streaming there (Porsche Penske and JOTA were not though).
This might shock you but the GTs have global OEMs and incredible fights, too. The multi class aspect is a big part of what makes Le Mans and endurance racing special, which makes it sad to see them largely ignored. Plus you can acknowledge a great race and still criticize the broadcast, you know. Those are seperate things.
Ignoring GT3 is a shame for sure but I do understand why LMP2 basically gets ignored.
Yeah and this era won't last forever Sooner or later GTs will have their limelight again but GT fans cannot seem to accept that and want 100% coverage now
The coverage of the other classes was shocking ltbh, I can maybe understand th LMP2, but GT3 was barely any better. As someone drifting in an out across the 24 hours I really had no idea which car was leading in the class at multiple times right up to the end
The coverage of LMP2 was a lot better towards the end of the race, although the fact that we had about 6 laps of a battle for second where neither car stayed on track for more than 30 saeconds probably helped!
The Jota crew deserve a big shout-out. Building up the #12 from a bare chassis in 24 hours, a process for which their previous best was 3 weeks, to running in the top 10 most of the race and finishing on the lead lap. The mechanics deserve to sleep for a week after this weekend.
Safety car definitely played a major role, however no denying that the field was really close on performance anyway. Too bad that due to 7 hours of SC (also a record, shameful one) and rainy conditions, only 311 laps were completed by the winner and the following 8 cars. Smallest completed distance by the overall winner in this century and second worst one since 1995, when race-winning McLaren went under 300 laps.
And that was only because it rained damn near 17 hours of the race. This race seemed heavily similar to that one in '95.
So after a century, the record has gone from 2 to 9? That's insane.
Where to find this ranking ?
By the font my guess would be Wikipedia
Yes, source is: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024\_24\_Hours\_of\_Le\_Mans#Race\_results](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_24_Hours_of_Le_Mans#Race_results) Official source can be found here: [https://www.fiawec.com/en/race/result/4865](https://www.fiawec.com/en/race/result/4865)
Will be interesting to see what they do with the SC rules next year. At the moment, you could make a case for optimising your car to be fastest in the last 4 hours - so long as you stay on the lead lap, that'll be when the race is won and lost. If #8 hadn't had the wheelnut issue, it wouldn't have been in a position to get punted by the #51.
2 Cadillac was looking so good for such a long time!
Cadillac was relying on a gamble scenario that unfortunately never came. They made the right play, if they didnt gamble they probably would finish in this spot anyway but luck didnt arrive
Cadillac & Porsche (and everyone else) never really had the pace/BOP to compete with Ferrari or Toyota. It is kind of the same story as last year, though the BOP was better this year
I dont think pace was an issue at that stage, Cadillac was pulling great laps during their gamble and couldve been in a winning position if the race played out how they wanted it
I love how extremely competitive it was this year, although I am truly salty about the result. Last year there was no dirty business going on and Toyota had a combination of mistakes and bad luck, and I was so pleased with Ferrari winning. This year it seems like everyone was ignoring all of Ferrari's BS all race. Be it the unsafe release, spraying oil messing up the number 7's vision, or the number 8 being punted. Ferrari was either getting ignored or getting a slap on the wrist by the stewards/race control. I'm happy for the #50 Ferrari drivers, but holy fuck were we robbed. It's true that Pechito shat the bed and spun, but alas, I'm quite upset. This stings a lot and seeing the sheer amount of shit being thrown at us online (mainly Instagram) by Ferrari and Porsche fans is batshit insane. Toyota needs a 3rd car, stat. Downvote away now.
You weren't robbed, if Lopez doesn't spin in the last hour, and there isn't the issue with the wheel at the pit stop then the Toyota probably wins. Not saying Ferrari didn't get the rub of the green with a couple of decisions, but Toyota lost the race with the mistakes they made!
Still can't believe Toyota planned their race with Lopez finishing. If Kobayashi was in the car at the end I wonder how it would've played out.
If you’re putting your fate in the hands of JML over Kobayashi……WHEN HISTORICALLY YOU ALWAYS END WITH THE JAPANESE DRIVER OF EACH CAR….what do you expect to happen? There’s a reason they demoted JML & that last hour showcased that. The two slip ups at Dunlop and coming off of the Mulsanne sunk him
Couldn’t you just as easily say if the Ferrari didn’t punt the Toyota they could have won?
You could also say that if it rained a but less in the final 90 minutes, Ferrari need an extra pitstop. No matter who wins, there are a list of "if this one thing was different, the other car wins"
Right but one of those is nature and one is a deliberate (accidental) act
Sure, then I say "If the ACO had made them fix the door a lap earlier" or "if the GT3 hadn't spun bringing out a slow zone" or "if the caddy hadn't gotten back on track after their crash" or "if the 7 hadn't spun in quali or had the punctures" or I can talk about the wheel nut
The punctures and weather were out of Toyota’s control. Sure, the spin wasn’t, but there’s no guarantee he would’ve fought for the win without the win. Likewise, that’s a mistake, it’s not a bad call from the officials. Bad calls aren’t ifs buts and maybes like a mistake is, they’re something that shouldn’t happen. There’s a big difference, and that’s why people are upset.
But it's not objectively a bad call. It's a call consistent with other decisions over the weekend
Which decisions are consistent with what decisions? Waiting half a stint to get the Ferrari to pit with an open door? Oh, that’d be consistent with Proton in Spa where they were given 3 laps (equivalent to 1.5 Le Mans laps). The decision not to have Ferrari pit to fix their broken rain light? Oh, that’s similar to telling Toyota to put and fix it in Spa 2023 (or maybe 2022 can’t remember the year) and ruining their race. The decision to only reprimand Ferrari for exceeding their energy usages? Sounds exactly like how the DSQed Peugeot for the same thing in Le Mans. The decision to give a 5s penalty after the #51 took out the lead Toyota? That’s consistent with every other race ruining incident which usually lands a 30s drive through. The decision not to penalise the unsafe pit release of the #50 car? That’s the same as every other unsafe pit release landing a 10s penalty. Mate, they made plenty of bad calls that weren’t consistent with anything. You’re lying through your teeth if you claim otherwise. Treat any one of them properly, and the #50 car doesn’t win and the #51 car doesn’t get a podium.
Yeah absolutely, but I still wouldn't define that as being robbed. If Toyota had ran a completely perfect race, made zero mistakes, and then lost due to debatable calls from the stewards/incidents on tracks, then you could say they were robbed. But they made a number of errors during the last two hours that cost them. If they hadn't they would have won.
Biggest bullshit I have ever read. Ferrari made loads of mistakes but only get the win because of the stewards. If Ferrari had delivered a flawless race I would agree with you. But not a single decision was made in favour of toyota. even the red flag in Q is a bit exaggerated. So clearly robbed.
First off, you can calm down mate. It's just a load of cars driving round a piece of tarmac 😂😂 They were not clearly robbed, I agree Ferrari made mistakes as well, pretty much every team did. Which is almost exactly my point, no one ran a flawless race, no one really had a clear pace advantage over the whole race, so no one really got robbed. I already agreed Ferrari probably got the benefit of a couple of decisions, but it's racing, sometimes that happens.
Sure, should calm down, but imagine working the whole year to win this race. Which, by the way, is much more than a few cars driving in circles. You're at the track for 16 hours every day for 11 days and awake for 42 hours on race day. Then another team comes and drives the leading car out of the race. And in the same team, a "not roadworthy" car with a non-functioning door and without complete headlights drives in the rain. A roll over without a working door, unimaginable. But Ferrari is allowed to continue. Toyota has to pit within 2 laps due to a sensor wobble. The race was not decided on the track and that's robbed. And the first statement from the Ferrari CEO: Teamwork makes the dream work. Especially when some decisions are signed with the same name as the main sponsor on the red cars. Coincidence. Wow...
Mate I get it, it must be supremely frustrating! I just feel you're looking too much on things Toyota can't control, rather than what they can. The car wasn't completely reliable, the engine had issues twice in the last couple of hours. There was the wheel nut issue in the last couple of hours, Lopez spun at Dunlop, went wide at Mulsanne. If you don't have those issues/make those mistakes, you most likely win the race!
Yes, of course. But if you won the race, if the right decisions and penalties had been given, then everything would be ok. But since you don't win due to wrong decisions and penalties on the part of the organization and someone else "gets" the victory, it's robbed. Nobody can expect a car to perform in such a way that wrong decisions are simply made good. What's more, if the Lexus had pushed away the #50 shortly before the end, it would have been 100% robbed. So why can a team resort to unfair means? It was 100% not a racing accident, he wasn't even on the racing line.
Mate there's nothing more for me to say. As a complete neutral I in no way came away from that race thinking anyone was robbed. Respectfully both yourself and a number of other Ferrari/Toyota fans came away with wildly different opinions as they have emotional bias to their teams which are preventing a balanced view of the race. It's just slightly ironic that before the race your Sporting Director was claiming that if other teams had lost the race they would have done a bad job, but now that Toyota lost, it's everyone else's fault but their own! 😂 Good luck at Interlagos!
If the 51 didn't fly down the inside on a wet track like a maniac they would have won too
Firstly your definition of flying down the outside like a maniac is a bit off. It was an overly ambitious move, but they are racing, sometimes that happens. Secondly the 8 lost about 40 seconds in that incident, and finished over a minute behind the leader.
TOM'S au/Deloitte GR010 Hypercar confirmed
Imagine 1992/1993 AGAIN. Peugeot with the talbot livery. Toyota with the Red & white livery. Shame about no V10s though
I’m a Porsche fan. Nearly all Porsche fans I’ve seen are pissed off as well. After the LMP1 era, I don’t think I’d ever say this but I was supporting Toyota just to see Ferrari not win, and most Porsche fans seemed to have been in the same boat. Likewise, the #6 should’ve been on that podium, not Osama bin Guidi. It’s just all of the tifosi coming over from F1 for this one race. Look at their profiles, highly active in F1 subs, but other then Le Mans they haven’t touched the WEC before. Thankfully we don’t have to deal with their shit come the next race, and at least karma is going to keep reaming them in F1.
Amen to all of this.
Be so fucking fr Toyota won every single race last year bar 1, Ferrari has only won 2 races since it entered for Christ's sake.
Firstly, I didn’t mention anything about last year, I’m only talking about the unfair decisions made by the FIA that objectively helped Ferrari win. Also, Toyota was more or less expected to dominate last year, at least for the start of the season. They’ve had been racing that car for 2 years prior to 2023, and they had a decade of racing top class prototypes before the GR010. They already knew how to maximise performance from their car before the start of 2023. The other teams didn’t, and Ferrari hadn’t even raced prototypes for over half a century. If somehow the BoP was perfect from race 1 (hard to do since the FIA wouldn’t have had the proper data), then you’d expect Toyota to run away due to being able to get more out of the car with their set ups. Yet Ferrari was immediately able to challenge Toyota? Then in Le Mans they were able to comfortably run away. Suggests they had a bit of a BoP advantage. So I’m not sure complaining about performances last year is what you want to be doing. Same with this year, excluding Qatar, they’ve been the clear fastest car and had a BoP advantage, including Le Mans. Porsche benefited in the 1st race, but since then Ferrari has been, they’ve just been to sh*t of a team to actually take advantage of it in Imola and Spa, and they even nearly screwed it up in Le Mans. They didn’t deserve to win, if they had been BoPed properly they wouldn’t have been on the lead lap with all of their issues this year. Regardless, this isn’t about the BoP which can be a simple mistake, it’s about the countless bad calls by the FIA which ended up helping Ferrari go win. It adds insult to injury and shouldn’t be happening.
Lmao ok remember it was a Toyota cockup that cost them the win
Lots of things cost them the win. Yes, some of those things were in Toyota’s control and without them they would’ve won. But most of them weren’t, and many of them shouldn’t happen. Something like the weather ruining a race isn’t in someone’s control, but it can happen. Something like the stewards giving favourable calls shouldn’t happen though, which is what people are upset about. If the stewards were fair, Ferrari wouldn’t have won. Also, don’t forget that Ferrari made a lot more mistakes that should’ve cost them the win. If Toyota did win, there’s a lot within their control that they could’ve done differently that would give them the win.
And they were both Le Mans. 😭😭
I think the release of the 50 wasn’t that bad, but the 51 should have been penalized a lot heavier. 50 wouldn’t have made it if a meatball was shown earlier though. But just like last year, Toyota once again made the wrong final driver choice: they would have won both if they didn’t went with their second (or even third) best driver (or last year the one with the least experience) for the last stint.
> spraying oil messing up the number 7's vision wasn't the oil spray first reported by Cadillac at the start of the race, so it wasn't just affecting Toyota (wouldn't that be a technical error?) >This stings a lot and seeing the sheer amount of shit being thrown at us online (mainly Instagram) by Ferrari and Porsche fans is batshit insane. WECcirclejerk being one of them
I'll head over there now and clean it up
Don't know why I would downvote. I have been rooting for #6 Porsche since the start of last year but this is just a very balanced take. I also would've preferred if Toyota won instead of Ferrari but there's always next year I guess
As a Porsche fan, I agree with you. Ferrari got away with everything.
Dude you arent wrong to feel like this. Ferrari got away with a lot. - Blown headlight on 50 - cars got DQ'd for this as its in the rules - 5secs for spinning out the leader - Leaky Ferrari basically spraying everyone behind. Caddy and the #7 got the worst of it. - at one point the stewards were investigating both Ferrari's for a major technical infringement but that disappeared as soon as it came lol Whan an effin joke. You would be a fool, someone ignorant or an Italian teenager with the English vocabulary of only the word"cry" in their arsenal to think the rules weren't bent for Ferrari
It never said major technical infringement tho. They were reprimanded for it, which happens a decent amount. Not all technical infringements are DSQ worthy
Plus the #83 murdered the BMW and should have gotten like a 5 min stop and hold penalty for it
Just to add, that technical infringement was for using too much energy in their stint. They got a reprimand for it, meanwhile Peugeot got DSQed for the same thing in Qatar.
It was about ERS deployment speed actually
Spinning out is nicely put. It's causing a collision, simple as that. 83 got SG30s for it.
Honestly, last year was already kinda iffy with the huge BoP break Ferrari had, where FIA had to change their own rule just to slow the Toyota down. But it was undeniable that Ferrari had a (Mostly) clean race and was on it. This year's is just sour and feel undeserved.
Feels as sour as the #8 win in 2019
No.7's robbery continues I'm glad at least they won 2021
On the contrary I believe we were completely robbed by unscheduled BOP change last year, this year we're just unlucky.
Ferrari were just getting their early 2000's F1 rub of the green! 😉
At the start of the race I was rooting for Ferrari, at the end I wanted Toyota to win and I feel exactly like you. That was only fair. I don't understand BOP, but I would guess there is also sometimes crooked going on.
at the end there was nine cars on the lead lap, hard to imagine a more fair BoP than that
7 hours of safety car helps that
Incredible, beautiful achievement
This race was a big win for the sport in terms of regulations. I can’t say it was really entertaining (maybe I’m just a salty Porsche fan) I can’t recall any real great battles or truly critical moments. I guess part of it is the nature of a race this long (and racing in general in many cases) a very large portion of this race was won and lost in the pits. Also can we talk about how incredibly reliable pretty much every hypercar was (lol Alpine)!?
TIL manufacturers have different engine capacity.
I still cannot figure out how Cadillac lost that much time in the last 1-2 hours. Their lap times must have been horrific in the rain
BoP cooked!
Also the first race in which a car drove 5+ laps before getting told to fix a door
Didn't the Proton Porsche in Spa go multiple laps with a door issue?
It seemed like there was precedent, yeah
Literally Spa this year you dingbat